|
My thoughts
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:02:55
Again, like I said earlier. If you're a good player and know how the game works, then you can start with a lv 90 and practice and get it down.
If you can't do that, you probably suck at the job regardless.
FFXI is not a hard game.
I'll agree, the more time you spend on a job, the better you get at it. But guess what, being lv 1-89 doesn't help that at all. Spending time as lv 90 you'll get better just as well.
[+]
Serveur: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1292
By Asura.Yunalaysca 2010-12-19 04:03:49
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: not at all. At lv 90, you have more utilities. While guard is a piece of ***and not worth lv'ing to begin with. You can grab multiple lower lv mobs at once and lv it much faster.
For example, you can go from 0 guard to 200ish in a few days. Get a rdm, and go to B tree. Get 15-20 mandies and phal II. They'll hit for 0-5. Easy to cure so you don't die, 20 mandies hitting twice per round and you think you'll lv it faster lv'ing? When I lv'd mnk the regular way, my guard skill was 96 at lv 75 true perhaps, this was coming from a dnc who had quite alot of face time with the mobs otw to 75 and had nearly 190 by then
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:04:48
Even then, can do the same thing w/ parry as you do guard.
And at least parry isn't worthless. Guard is just worthless
VIP
Serveur: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
By Siren.Kalilla 2010-12-19 04:05:21
Siren.Flunklesnarkin said: ....tl/dr.. old ffxi is gone.. either move on to a new challenging game.. or enjoy the casual aspects of the new ffxi
I still enjoy it, even though I find myself working harder than ever to get those stupid seals and +2 items than I ever did before abyssea lol.
Serveur: Ramuh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 16303
By Ramuh.Sagittario 2010-12-19 04:07:21
Exactly, playing the game is not rocket science. There are just those who suck and those who don't. Of course practice will help, but only making a good player better.
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:10:42
Reminds me the time I didn't even have ninja unlocked and played my friend's ninja while he fell asleep soloing organs in sea. Nin/rdm. Took I'd say an hour to get my timing down w/ shadows and which ninjutsu to use, etc. How to keep myself alive.
Ragnarok.Zanno
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1393
By Ragnarok.Zanno 2010-12-19 04:13:13
Meh.
"FFXI is easy hurr"
Who'd wanna play an easy game without challanges anyway? Might as well play monopoly with yourself.
inb4: it's a challange to grind levels!
Because this game use to be about more than that, quests, missions, exploring, adventuring, crafting, making gil, hunting that *** lv 12 NM because you really really want what it drops (Read LL and VE, Argus), doing the quests for RSE and actually be excited to get to the lv where you can finally equip it. First trip to kahzam, first airship flight.
But I guess as long as you research your job and can get to max lv within a day, everything else you miss out doesnt matter, right?
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:15:13
Grinding out the same, boring thing repetitively isn't really missing out on anything.
I guess Abysseans never had a first airship flight, huh? It was just always there!
VIP
Serveur: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
By Siren.Kalilla 2010-12-19 04:15:37
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Your role in an exp group 99% of the time is going to be different from your role in endgame group.
There really isn't an endgame anymore >.>; More like FFXI went back to square one with a bunch of NM's out for people to kill. They didn't even put confluxes in areas that required some mission advancement, was all in original areas.
There is no mission advancement to advance to places that abyssea cant take you, because abyssea overtakes anything you can get anywhere else.
So learning how to skillchain properly is not going to happen in abyssea, nor is magic bursting and what to use for what skillchain.
Sure, research and practice or knowledge from your previous job will fix that but not if your a new player. Previous knowledge and skills shouldn't count when your comparing the two.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:18:11
By the term endgame, I mean things you do at lv 90.
Also, you need to learn to skill chain? Really? It's common knowledge how to do so, it's a matter of practicing 3 times till you get it right. It doesn't take 89 lvs worth of exping in a pt to learn to SC
[+]
Ragnarok.Zanno
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1393
By Ragnarok.Zanno 2010-12-19 04:18:23
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Grinding out the same, boring thing repetitively isn't really missing out on anything.
I guess Abysseans never had a first airship flight, huh? It was just always there!
Because everyone have been in this game since release.
Ragnarok.Zanno said:
The last few weeks I played i spent a lot of time with a new player in game. I think it took them around 2 weeks to get from lv 1-85 (mind you this person had never played this game before). When it was time for them to fight maat, they gave their game info to someone else and let them beat him for them (they were playing whm).
They were basically a WHM85/RDM10. They never took the time to stop leveling in order to either quest for spells or farm gil to buy spells. they had no tele spells, and only protectra/shellra 3, no raise 3. They were running around in lv 10 gear until they could equip AF3 (NQ). They were still rank 1, didnt have access to kazham etc etc.
Now This person obviously wasn't a bad person. They just did what SE gave them the ability to do.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:21:55
Quote: The last few weeks I played i spent a lot of time with a new player in game. I think it took them around 2 weeks to get from lv 1-85 (mind you this person had never played this game before). When it was time for them to fight maat, they gave their game info to someone else and let them beat him for them (they were playing whm).
Quote: Again, like I said earlier. If you're a good player and know how the game works, then you can start with a lv 90 and practice and get it down.
If you can't do that, you probably suck at the job regardless.
FFXI is not a hard game.
[+]
VIP
Serveur: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
By Siren.Kalilla 2010-12-19 04:22:33
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: By the term endgame, I mean things you do at lv 90.
Is fishing endgame then? >.>
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Also, you need to learn to skill chain? Really? It's common knowledge how to do so, it's a matter of practicing 3 times till you get it right. It doesn't take 89 lvs worth of exping in a pt to learn to SC
You would think so, but there are people who cant grasp the concept at all. And by skillchaining I'm not talking about making a skillchain, I'm talking about using the skillchain to your advantage and performing the right one under the right circumstance also knowing what you can make with what job/weapon.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:22:40
Leveling helps less skilled players. The ones who know what the *** they're doing or don't know but can learn by researching will be fine.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:23:27
Quote: You would think so, but there are people who cant grasp the concept at all. And by skillchaining I'm not talking about making a skillchain, I'm talking about using the skillchain to your advantage and performing the right one under the right circumstance also knowing what you can make with what job/weapon.
Again, that's just a shitty player.
[+]
VIP
Serveur: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
By Siren.Kalilla 2010-12-19 04:26:41
But old players aren't going to stay around forever tiger lol. The game will need new players and with abyssea they aren't going to have the knowledge we do. This is my whole point, the process of abyssea teaches people nothing and it just shits out level 90 players with nothing but the exp. It takes an experienced player to make a level 90 something into something good, but new players wont know wtf they're doing and follow by example.
Abyssea is what players will do after level 30, or close to it, and it teaches no skills needed to play the game at all.
[+]
Ragnarok.Zanno
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1393
By Ragnarok.Zanno 2010-12-19 04:27:48
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Quote: The last few weeks I played i spent a lot of time with a new player in game. I think it took them around 2 weeks to get from lv 1-85 (mind you this person had never played this game before). When it was time for them to fight maat, they gave their game info to someone else and let them beat him for them (they were playing whm).
Quote: Again, like I said earlier. If you're a good player and know how the game works, then you can start with a lv 90 and practice and get it down.
If you can't do that, you probably suck at the job regardless.
FFXI is not a hard game.
you really are close minded right? Just because there's end game in ffxi doesnt mean that all ffxi is is end game. If it were, SE might as well just let you log on naked @99 the first time you ever play and let you just do end game to get the gear you want.
Just because you have played this game for a long time, and done all quests, missions, seen all areas, and done everything else there is to do, doesnt mean its a good thing to take away a big chunk of the game for new players.
You can't just see everything from your point of view. Everyone don't like the things you like, and they don't suck because they're not like you.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:28:20
Spamming provoke on pld/war for 75 lvs doesn't teach you shout about tanking on pld/nin, either. What's your point?
When you get max level you'll learn the things you need for max level. Most of the ***you learn along the way isn't even applied anymore in most cases.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:31:07
Quote: Just because you have played this game for a long time, and done all quests, missions, seen all areas, and done everything else there is to do, doesnt mean its a good thing to take away a big chunk of the game for new players.
You can't just see everything from your point of view. Everyone don't like the things you like, and they don't suck because they're not like you.
If they want to do it that bad, nothing is stopping them. People do abyssea to lv more quickly because they want to. Anyonew ho wants to go slow as *** and level is damn well free to do as they choose. Doing Abyssea to lv is a choice.
Nobody has to be like me not to suck. I'm saying they have to know how to learn their job not to suck and leveling the "traditional way" isn't the only nor most efficient way of doing so.
It's an option and a choice, just like abyssea, but suggesting that it is required in order to turn out a good player is just HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE and ridiculous.
[+]
By RingmastersWord 2010-12-19 04:34:12
Siren.Kalilla said: Sylph.Tigerwoods said: By the term endgame, I mean things you do at lv 90.
Is fishing endgame then? >.>
LOL! Awesome.
[+]
VIP
Serveur: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
By Siren.Kalilla 2010-12-19 04:35:19
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Leveling helps less skilled players.
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: ...suggesting that it is required in order to turn out a good player is just HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE and ridiculous.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:36:40
Siren.Kalilla said: Sylph.Tigerwoods said: Leveling helps less skilled players.
Sylph.Tigerwoods said: ...suggesting that it is required in order to turn out a good player is just HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE and ridiculous. And?
I was talking about shitty players in the top quote and good players in the bottom quote.
[+]
VIP
Serveur: Siren
Game: FFXI
Posts: 14552
By Siren.Kalilla 2010-12-19 04:38:08
You said "to turn out a good player", suggesting your starting with a player with no experience.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:39:37
I'll rephrase: To be less shitty of a player than they currently are.
Ragnarok.Zanno
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 1393
By Ragnarok.Zanno 2010-12-19 04:42:53
It's not just about the leveling to learn their job.
Have you even talked with a new player lately?
How the hell are they going to know about the things we did when we lv 5 years ago, if no one tells them? Dont you find it even the slightest bit sad that some people have AF 3+2 gear but have no idea where gusgen mines is?
When I started this game, leveling was the least fun and least exciting part of the game. However, beeing forced to explore new areas, beeing forced to figure out ways to make gil for this or that spell or gear was a big part of the game.
As it is now, SE might as well just close all areas that aren't jeuno or abyssea.
But I guess some people, like me, played the game because they truely enjoyed it, while others just played it to get to be the first to get x level, or be the first to get x gear, grow their epeen an inch by doing 0.00002% more damage than that n00b over there.
Thats why I quit, I've seen it all. Now it's just repetative. Same ***different days.
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:43:28
You don't need experience. You can gain experience as you play the job. Again, you don't need to be lv 1 to get this experience. You can get the experience as a max lv job.
Like my previous example as playing 75 nin before I had the job unlocked. I had no experience walking into it and walking out of it I had plenty. Played for a few hours. next day I played more. By the end of the week, I was tanking sky NMs as his nin when I didn't even have the job unlocked.
[+]
Serveur: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 23653
By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-12-19 04:44:54
A new expansion is what I want mainly. Abyssea fantasy XI is boring to say the least.
At least at 75 you needed to pool gear from lots of places therefore more events were done.
Yeah I could go do Sky right now, but what's the point?
[+]
By Artemicion 2010-12-19 04:45:07
Remember when accuracy > haste?
Yeah I do too.
[+]
Serveur: Sylph
Game: FFXI
Posts: 15064
By Sylph.Tigerwoods 2010-12-19 04:45:47
Quote: How the hell are they going to know about the things we did when we lv 5 years ago, if no one tells them?
By researching it?
When people quit the game, the data and all their progress doesn't magically disappear.
Quote: Dont you find it even the slightest bit sad that some people have AF 3+2 gear but have no idea where gusgen mines is?
Do you find it sad that we're not made to use a slide rule before learning how to use a calculator?
Quote: But I guess some people, like me, played the game because they truely enjoyed it, while others just played it to get to be the first to get x level, or be the first to get x gear, grow their epeen an inch by doing 0.00002% more damage than that n00b over there.
I enjoy the game just fine, tyvm. Again, I don't even think either of you are listening to what I'm saying. Anyone who WANTS to do that stuff can. I'm simply saying it's not required, where you two are heavily implying that it is.
[+]
Some things have been going through my mind lately about FFXI. Back when I started playing leveling was an adventure, as much as a pain in my ass. Okay, 10% adventure 90% a pain in my ass. Still, actually hitting level 75 meant something to me back then. Leveling was rough before Aht Urhgan (not so much Lumoria (sea) if you were one of those people that had it before Aht Urhgan and actually leveled there). I'm talking about the days when you got 75 in Tu'Lia (sky) killing Aura Statues maybe pulling off 5k exp an hour, maybe! And then getting your ass handed to you when Ullikummi popped, or being forced to level on Aura Weapons and Decorative Weapons when there were Linkshells/botters/hackers/gil sellers abusing the area around Ullikummi at a much slower pace than 5k exp an hour.
Being able to use a ring to give you extra exp per kill, being able to level with people level 10 or 30 when your level 60 through level sync. Everyone of these examples, and more unmentioned because I don't want to think of all the ways you can make EXP stupidly (before abyssea), are ways SE have given into our demands to be lazy and get what we want easier demeaning the work that others have done in the past to get what you want right now even if you don't truly deserve it.
Even considering you could get 1200 exp in a chest back then was crazy, let alone getting 100,000 exp in 30-60 minutes by killing a handful of mobs and building "lights".
All of us are being spoiled by Abyssea, no matter how you look at it. The game is so unbalanced at the moment. Why would anyone spend 5 hours doing 5k-10k an hour when you could do Abyssea. The fact you can level with 18 people and not have EXP penalties is ridiculous. Whats more ridiculous is 99% of the FFXI community are in Abyssea or AFK in Jeuno/Whitegate.
But Abyssea has given us the opportunity to level jobs we once wished we had but didn't have the time/motivation to do so because it could take months just to get the levels for the job. I have leveled jobs in Abyssea, but who wouldn't given the opportunity to through a buy-able expansion...
Honestly, SE needs to make the minimum level required to enter Abyssea level 75 since it came out when the level cap was raised after 9 years. No one is learning shit about their jobs leveling it from 30-90 in a few hours. SE slapped all its loyal players in the face for making the minimum level so low. All their hard work that they put in leveling for months, and seeking for hours and hours and hours..., because they wanted to be that job, means nothing now. Forget about armor, its always been replaced slowly update after update. It's the time we spent into leveling that really bothers me. Square-Enix make the required level to enter Abyssea level 75.
I miss when a Maats cap actually was an awesome achievement.
I'd be surprised if any of the players who started when Abyssea came out actually has a map of crawlers nest, or knows what a stone monument is. Or has leveled a craft, fished, leveled in any place other than Abyssea past level 30... has walked up to the throne room or has done dynamis. Hell, if they even have any of the CoP missions done.
There was an important progression leveling up to 75. You got to experience so much of the game, so many zones. Done so many activities and met so many people. The people, seriously. Anyone who has leveled before level sync knows this, that when you leveled you leveled with the same group of people (kinda), but you saw a lot of people and teamed up and made friends. Instead we are practically forced to visit 9 areas of the game and that's it.
Everything else is just so empty... :\
If I was SE I would want my players to use all the areas that they released and for everyone to experience them and experience the game, not just 9 areas. This is a game we should all experience together and have adventures and experiences but for me I don't see what they are thinking. The monsters in those areas make NO sense. They don't correspond to the area really... a corpselight is a scary lil thing, why are they even near cockatrices or scorpions or...adamantoises?! Okay, maybe they should of introduced more adamantoises in the game, and Wyrms. Not a whole lot of people got to experience those besides mission/quest versions which was actually a really cool way to get to experience a Wyrm (Ouryu) when most of them are monopolized by HNM LS's. But now you can experience just about any type of monster in the game by walking through 1 single area... its so stupid.
I'm not going to quit over it, but its just aggravating when this game was so fun once upon a time, and now its so much...smaller.
|
|