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 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2019-05-09 13:02:23
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Yes, in that gigantic wall of text spam, you need to be watching to see if you missed one attack, and then adjust WS accordingly.... All in the name of optimizing DPS
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By SimonSes 2019-05-09 13:10:48
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Yes, in that gigantic wall of text spam, you need to be watching to see if you missed one attack, and then adjust WS accordingly.... All in the name of optimizing DPS

If you play MNK often, you can tell really fast when your Impetus stacks dropped. It's not only a miss in chat (tho you can spot that too with right filters and color settings with battlemod addon), but also your crit rate and crit damage drops by up to 50% and you will notice that really fast when you are familiar with your MNK.
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 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2019-05-09 14:35:15
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SimonSes said: »
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Yes, in that gigantic wall of text spam, you need to be watching to see if you missed one attack, and then adjust WS accordingly.... All in the name of optimizing DPS

If you play MNK often, you can tell really fast when your Impetus stacks dropped. It's not only a miss in chat (tho you can spot that too with right filters and color settings with battlemod addon), but also your crit rate and crit damage drops by up to 50% and you will notice that really fast when you are familiar with your MNK.

Agreed that it should be fairly apparent when your white damage drops like a rock.

If someone wants an even more clear display, I also can't imagine it would be exceedingly difficult for the more coding-oriented among us (which isn't me, so maybe I'm wrong here) to write an addon to display when Impetus chains reset/current number of consecutive hits/etc.

SimonSes said: »
Ideally with Veret in longer event I would:
0-3min Focus+Impetus+Smite
3-4min Focus+Smite (Focus will wear off after 30 sec, but nothing you can do about that)
4-5min Footwork+TK

If you notice that you missed with Impetus up, it might be better to hold TP for RF (or TK if you zerg and use Footwork+Impetus).

This makes a lot of sense to me, thanks for your insight.

What is your opinion on how (or if) other weapons change things? In particular:
(a) Godhands
(b) Anything that isn't Godhands or Vere
 Bismarck.Nyaarun
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By Bismarck.Nyaarun 2019-05-09 14:48:48
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Bismarck.Gippali said: »
Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Tbh, any fight you opt to pop 1hr is a fight youve opted to not seriously participate in, so i wouldnt use the argument of "well a war can pop their ms and out damage a monk". Yeah, if youre gunna conduit burn things, youre aiming to not even participate in the fight or deal with its mechanics to begin with, and id hardly factor it into a real discussion.

Only thing I would even marginally agree with is the AC smn zerg part. But saying "Using 1hrs is opting to not participate" is just plain goofy. I blow all my 1hr's (Soul Enslave/Inner Strength/etc)on Albumen/HELM that are very useful. It's a pretty terrible blanket statement.

Also, MNK is great. Play it and have fun.

Sure, now youre waiting an hour or more to do it again. Not the greatest strat for things imo if you can only do it once an hour. One hours simply exist to allow you to not deal with a single fight, thats what theyve always been, for the most part. (Or an oh ***gunna wipe button, ala pld/whm).
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2019-05-09 14:55:33
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Yes, because Invincible can block those pesky spells and magical TP moves.

And if you have to use Benediction in a fight, you are probably not going to win the next one.

Your own argument falls apart against your own argument.
 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2019-05-09 14:58:17
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Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Sure, now youre waiting an hour or more to do it again. Not the greatest strat for things imo if you can only do it once an hour. One hours simply exist to allow you to not deal with a single fight, thats what theyve always been, for the most part. (Or an oh ***gunna wipe button, ala pld/whm).

Dude, people use offensive 1hrs (if mastered, 45mins) all the time for the handful of truly difficult fights in the game where zergs matter. HELM/WoC/Kirin, some VD Ambuscades, etc.

People can also reset SP abilities through Escha/Reisenjima temp items, MMM or Revitalizers, Wild Card, etc. It's often well worth the time to reset to, for example, get a ton of Ambuscade points from a hard VD fight that works well with a zerg requiring 1hrs. An extra few minutes between fights to reset abilities can be the difference between being able to reliably kill the thing on VD repeatedly for FAR better points per hour than spamming the fight on easier difficulty.
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2019-05-09 15:01:02
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Don't mind him, he thinks that WHMs shouldn't melee in CP parties because the DDs die in 1 TP move there.
 Bismarck.Nyaarun
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By Bismarck.Nyaarun 2019-05-09 15:09:45
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Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Sure, now youre waiting an hour or more to do it again. Not the greatest strat for things imo if you can only do it once an hour. One hours simply exist to allow you to not deal with a single fight, thats what theyve always been, for the most part. (Or an oh ***gunna wipe button, ala pld/whm).

Dude, people use offensive 1hrs (if mastered, 45mins) all the time for the handful of truly difficult fights in the game where zergs matter. HELM/WoC/Kirin, some VD Ambuscades, etc.

People can also reset SP abilities through Escha/Reisenjima temp items, MMM or Revitalizers, Wild Card, etc. It's often well worth the time to reset to, for example, get a ton of Ambuscade points from a hard VD fight that works well with a zerg requiring 1hrs. An extra few minutes between fights to reset abilities can be the difference between being able to reliably kill the thing on VD repeatedly for FAR better points per hour than spamming the fight on easier difficulty.

Also known as; ignoring the fight and actual mechanics of the fight.
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By SimonSes 2019-05-09 15:09:58
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You can check page 242. I spent quite a lot of time optimizing set and checking various builds with various buffs using spreadsheet. Godhands is very good for Impetus down and ideally you would probably want to switch weapons for Impetus up and down, unless you SC with Smite.

Spharai is really balanced weapon and Final heaven is very good for Impetus down. You can also build a set with 39%PDT/27%MDT and 78% counter, but not sure if that has any real application :D

Sagitta also falls in balanced weapon category. Path A is like lesser empy AM with big bonus to stp and but you also get -10% damage taken.

Ambuscade h2h is good if you don't plan to get anything to R15.

Glanz is ok, but it's good performance doens't really comes from its augments to focus/dodge or mythic WS, but simply because it's AM3 helps with TP gain and improves WS damage because Smite really likes MA proc. It's also very good when you for some reason has VERY low pdif, because it's the only scenario when Ascetic's fury is good.
 Bismarck.Nyaarun
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By Bismarck.Nyaarun 2019-05-09 15:10:06
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Don't mind him, he thinks that WHMs shouldn't melee in CP parties because the DDs die in 1 TP move there.

Again, a claim ive never stated.
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2019-05-09 15:13:48
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Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Sure, now youre waiting an hour or more to do it again. Not the greatest strat for things imo if you can only do it once an hour. One hours simply exist to allow you to not deal with a single fight, thats what theyve always been, for the most part. (Or an oh ***gunna wipe button, ala pld/whm).

Dude, people use offensive 1hrs (if mastered, 45mins) all the time for the handful of truly difficult fights in the game where zergs matter. HELM/WoC/Kirin, some VD Ambuscades, etc.

People can also reset SP abilities through Escha/Reisenjima temp items, MMM or Revitalizers, Wild Card, etc. It's often well worth the time to reset to, for example, get a ton of Ambuscade points from a hard VD fight that works well with a zerg requiring 1hrs. An extra few minutes between fights to reset abilities can be the difference between being able to reliably kill the thing on VD repeatedly for FAR better points per hour than spamming the fight on easier difficulty.

Also known as; ignoring the fight and actual mechanics of the fight.
Also known as: Being efficient in this game.

Something you have yet to try.

Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Don't mind him, he thinks that WHMs shouldn't melee in CP parties because the DDs die in 1 TP move there.

Again, a claim ive never stated.
Bless your little heart

Actually, that whole thread is evidence that you know nothing about this game.
 Bismarck.Nyaarun
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By Bismarck.Nyaarun 2019-05-09 16:01:07
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Sure, now youre waiting an hour or more to do it again. Not the greatest strat for things imo if you can only do it once an hour. One hours simply exist to allow you to not deal with a single fight, thats what theyve always been, for the most part. (Or an oh ***gunna wipe button, ala pld/whm).

Dude, people use offensive 1hrs (if mastered, 45mins) all the time for the handful of truly difficult fights in the game where zergs matter. HELM/WoC/Kirin, some VD Ambuscades, etc.

People can also reset SP abilities through Escha/Reisenjima temp items, MMM or Revitalizers, Wild Card, etc. It's often well worth the time to reset to, for example, get a ton of Ambuscade points from a hard VD fight that works well with a zerg requiring 1hrs. An extra few minutes between fights to reset abilities can be the difference between being able to reliably kill the thing on VD repeatedly for FAR better points per hour than spamming the fight on easier difficulty.

Also known as; ignoring the fight and actual mechanics of the fight.
Also known as: Being efficient in this game.

Something you have yet to try.

Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Asura.Kingnobody said: »
Don't mind him, he thinks that WHMs shouldn't melee in CP parties because the DDs die in 1 TP move there.

Again, a claim ive never stated.
Bless your little heart

Actually, that whole thread is evidence that you know nothing about this game.

Not really being efficient, just showing one actively doesnt want to play the game and just skip it.

Also congrats, the link doesnt actually show what you claim.
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By eliroo 2019-05-09 16:02:54
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2(1(.75))hours are literally part of the game....
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 Bismarck.Gippali
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By Bismarck.Gippali 2019-05-09 16:17:56
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Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Not really being efficient, just showing one actively doesnt want to play the game and just skip it.

Yup, that's exactly what it means. Pack it up guys, we can head home now.
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2019-05-09 16:20:13
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Bismarck.Nyaarun said: »
Not really being efficient, just showing one actively doesnt want to play the game and just skip it.

Also congrats, the link doesnt actually show what you claim.
Well, thanks once again for proving you suck.

Thanks for playing "Can Nyaarun Condradict Himself Again?" with us. Here's your parting gift, don't let the door hit your bum on the way out.
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By fonewear 2019-05-09 16:59:21
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I play monk for Chi Blast mostly Chi Blast is seriously powerful.
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2019-05-09 17:14:59
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fonewear said: »
I play monk for Chi Blast mostly Chi Blast is seriously powerful.
I bet that you do a party chat macro every time you use it.
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 Bismarck.Zubuis
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By Bismarck.Zubuis 2019-05-12 18:40:02
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Does anyone have a mnk lua that works properly with impetus and body? I am having issues.
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By Sidiov 2019-05-12 18:52:44
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Bismarck.Zubuis said: »
Does anyone have a mnk lua that works properly with impetus and body? I am having issues.
fone does. it chi blasts when impetus up.
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 Lakshmi.Watusa
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By Lakshmi.Watusa 2019-05-15 03:07:05
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Bismarck.Zubuis said: »
Does anyone have a mnk lua that works properly with impetus and body? I am having issues.

I had the same problem with the ones I was finding online, they made it so overly complicated. I just added this into my lua instead:
Code
 sets.engaged.Impetus = set_combine(sets.engaged, {body="Bhikku Cyclas +1"})
	sets.engaged.Acc.Impetus = set_combine(sets.engaged.Acc, {body="Bhikku Cyclas +1"})
	sets.engaged.SomeAcc.Impetus = set_combine(sets.engaged.SomeAcc, {body="Bhikku Cyclas +1"})


You'd have to re-write one for every new base engaged set you'd make though. I imagine there's an easier way to trigger it for all sets, but I dunno.
 Cerberus.Hokuten
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By Cerberus.Hokuten 2019-05-15 11:25:09
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To customize your melee set...
Code
function customize_melee_set(meleeSet)
    if buffactive.impetus then
        meleeSet= set_combine(meleeSet, {body="Bhikku Cyclas +1"})
    end

    return meleeSet
end


To customize your WS set.
Code
function job_post_precast(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
    if spell.type == 'WeaponSkill' then
        if buffactive.impetus and (spell.english == "Victory Smite" or spell.english == "Ascetic's Fury") then
            equip(sets.whateveryouwanttocallit)
        end
    end
end
 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2019-05-16 21:39:33
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Increase footwork duration to 2Mins!
 Lakshmi.Watusa
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By Lakshmi.Watusa 2019-05-21 21:21:34
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ItemSet 332953

From this Victory Smite set posted on front page, what are the augments for Ryuo hands, Herc Boots and Mantle for BiS?
 Shiva.Berzerk
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By Shiva.Berzerk 2019-05-21 21:40:18
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Lakshmi.Watusa said: »
ItemSet 332953

From this Victory Smite set posted on front page, what are the augments for Ryuo hands, Herc Boots and Mantle for BiS?

I was thinking the same thing a bit ago and came up with:

Back: STR+30, ACC/ATK +20, Crit hit rate +10%
Ryuo hands: Path A (STR+12, DEX+12, Accuracy +20)
Herc feet: STR+10 (or higher) ACC/ATK, Crit hit dmg.

Also I went with relic +3 legs instead for the crit hit rate since WSD doesn't help much with Victory Smite (afaik) and it's not a huge drop in STR


I'd be interested to hear feedback if this is in the right direction or if any changes are needed to the augs I suggested.
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By Kyniker 2019-05-21 21:45:52
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So, sorry for asking if it was already posted, but I just started with MNK and I'm trying to find what is BiS for WS, TP and whatever other sets MNK needs. Anyone mind linking them for me? Also, just VS is ok, or should I try to SC with other WSs?
 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2019-05-21 22:00:51
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Shiva.Berzerk said: »
Lakshmi.Watusa said: »
ItemSet 332953

From this Victory Smite set posted on front page, what are the augments for Ryuo hands, Herc Boots and Mantle for BiS?

I was thinking the same thing a bit ago and came up with:

Back: STR+30, ACC/ATK +20, Crit hit rate +10%
Ryuo hands: Path A (STR+12, DEX+12, Accuracy +20)
Herc feet: STR+10 (or higher) ACC/ATK, Crit hit dmg.

Also I went with relic +3 legs instead for the crit hit rate since WSD doesn't help much with Victory Smite (afaik) and it's not a huge drop in STR


I'd be interested to hear feedback if this is in the right direction or if any changes are needed to the augs I suggested.
Well this is pretty spot on. Tho I find those pants would be a bit redundant with impeteus up considering you would be able hit to if not 100% crit rate. I assume that’s why people go with the ambu legs. WSD as Minoot as it is when it comes to VS would still be better than the Crit Rate that offers nothing.

Now when impetus is down it’s a whole different story.
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 Asura.Topace
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By Asura.Topace 2019-05-21 22:01:54
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Kyniker said: »
So, sorry for asking if it was already posted, but I just started with MNK and I'm trying to find what is BiS for WS, TP and whatever other sets MNK needs. Anyone mind linking them for me? Also, just VS is ok, or should I try to SC with other WSs?
Have you checked the first page? It’s pretty up to date beside few relic swaps.
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By Shiva.Berzerk 2019-05-21 22:32:19
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Asura.Topace said: »
Shiva.Berzerk said: »
Lakshmi.Watusa said: »
ItemSet 332953

From this Victory Smite set posted on front page, what are the augments for Ryuo hands, Herc Boots and Mantle for BiS?

I was thinking the same thing a bit ago and came up with:

Back: STR+30, ACC/ATK +20, Crit hit rate +10%
Ryuo hands: Path A (STR+12, DEX+12, Accuracy +20)
Herc feet: STR+10 (or higher) ACC/ATK, Crit hit dmg.

Also I went with relic +3 legs instead for the crit hit rate since WSD doesn't help much with Victory Smite (afaik) and it's not a huge drop in STR


I'd be interested to hear feedback if this is in the right direction or if any changes are needed to the augs I suggested.
Well this is pretty spot on. Tho I find those pants would be a bit redundant with impeteus up considering you would be able hit to if not 100% crit rate. I assume that’s why people go with the ambu legs. WSD as Minoot as it is when it comes to VS would still be better than the Crit Rate that offers nothing.

Now when impetus is down it’s a whole different story.

Good point, I see the redundancy. Is the begrudging ring redundant also then should regal ring be swapped in?
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By Asura.Sechs 2019-05-22 01:15:12
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If attack is uncapped and you don't need the extra accuracy, Tonberry neck + Regal Ring should perform better than JSE neck + Begrudging.

WSD will also perform better in the Legs and Cape slot if we assume Impetus up.
WSD, as we all know, works only on the first hit of Vsmite. It has to be said that tipically the first hit deals a lot more damage than the other 3+ hits.

Concerning the cape I remember tests performed by Byrth some time ago (way before the 99% acc patch) that showed WSD+10% outperforming 10% crit in the cape slot even with Impetus Down, good luck finding those results within this thread though =/

Hizamaru+2 vs Hesychast+3 is a bit different, I dunno. +8 STR (and more acc) on Hizamaru, but 7% WSD vs 8% crit (and less att on Hiza if we're assuming uncapped situations).
Would need to be tested maybe.


Also I guess it depends on the Weapon you're using. You showed Godhands. With Godhands you shouldn't be using Vsmite outside of Impetus to begin with (unless for SC purposes) so I'm not sure you should even bother to question what to use with Impetus down, simply because you shouldn't be using Vsmite if it's down.

Even if you have Verethragna and Impetus is down, it can potentially be more beneficial to wait for 1750+ TP while riding AM and then shooting either Raging Fists or Tornado Kick (Footwork up).
I think SimonSes showed this. We have the habit of thinking that shooting WS as soon as possible is normally the best route to go, but at least on MNK and especially while riding AM that's not the case appearently, according to Simon's tests.


tl;dr
I wouldn't bother too much about Vsmite setup outside of Impetus if I were you, and would focus on gearing it up for when the JA is up, which means WSD/otherstats should win over Crit Rate+
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By Kyniker 2019-05-22 01:15:53
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CerberusFreaky said: »
I should have clarified I use Verethragna...
Impetus VS set:
http://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/366081

NON-Imp VS set:
http://www.ffxiah.com/item-sets/366089

Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
For non Impetus Smite, I'd swap Mummu hands for Adhemar Wristbands +1. You get 4% critical rate from set bonus which is close to Mummu's 6%, but a better spike damage addition with TA+4 vs DA+6. Also, according to Byrth's sets, Anchorite Cyclas +3 should be best non-impetus body.

Sorry, last post was supossed to quote this lol. I just made an account for asking here. Anyway, I can't find "Byrth's sets" and I was wondering if the Godhands sets for both Impetus and VS were different to the ones for Vere
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