~First And Final Line Of Defense V2.0~

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~First and Final Line of Defense v2.0~
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 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2020-06-24 22:48:43
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While thinking about some of the ideas floating around for the next PLD update, I got curious about the cure recast reduction on Majesty.

The reduction appears to be Cure recast -25%

I wanted to see if if could bypass the 80% recast reduction cap, but with -80% reduction all cures have a 1 second recast even before Majesty. Kinda hard to tell. I'm not sure you can even have a 0 recast outside of quick magic procs.

Data.
Code
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
|      |      | 0haste  |            |          |         |        |         |  | 224/1024 slow |           |          |         |
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
| Cure | base | Majesty | .+22% slow | Maj+22%S | Maj mod | recast | floored |  | Slow mod      | post slow | majesty  | Floored |
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
| I    | 5.0  | 3       | 6          | 4        | 0.75    | 3.75   | 3       |  | 1.21875       | 6.09375   | 4.570313 | 4       |
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
| II   | 5.5  | 4       | 6          | 5        | 0.75    | 4.125  | 4       |  | 1.21875       | 6.703125  | 5.027344 | 5       |
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
| III  | 6.0  | 4       | 7          | 5        | 0.75    | 4.5    | 4       |  | 1.21875       | 7.3125    | 5.484375 | 5       |
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
| IV   | 8.0  | 6       | 9          | 7        | 0.75    | 6      | 6       |  | 1.21875       | 9.75      | 7.3125   | 7       |
+------+------+---------+------------+----------+---------+--------+---------+--+---------------+-----------+----------+---------+
Also, Table generators are awesome.
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 Asura.Arico
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By Asura.Arico 2020-06-25 00:58:16
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Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
Does Burtgang's Enm+23 work if offhanded?

no.
 Asura.Akivatoo
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By Asura.Akivatoo 2020-06-25 05:05:52
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Like Aegis/Ochain didn't actually work well as offhand, oh wait!
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By Ruaumoko 2020-06-25 05:47:27
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I'm cautiously optimistic about this third update to Paladin. I think as they did with Monk, they've been gradually updating it so they can gauge how substantial the final update will be.

An update to Majesty is definitely on the cards, we saw it in the update preview. The blurb said 'job adjustments for Paladins' so we're in for a few other more and they might not all be for job abilities.
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By RadialArcana 2020-06-25 10:04:53
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The animation they are showing on PLD is from SCH, accession.

In theory that could mean they are making flash > ga with that ability.
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 Pandemonium.Zeto
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By Pandemonium.Zeto 2020-06-25 10:15:45
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That's Majesty's animation too...
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By Chyula 2020-06-25 10:44:38
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Fix useless Shield bash, give it full break effect.
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By Wotasu 2020-06-25 10:46:17
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Fix shields period...
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2020-06-25 10:46:39
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RadialArcana said: »
The animation they are showing on PLD is from SCH, accession.

In theory that could mean they are making flash > ga with that ability.
They reused the Accession animation for Majesty. Just left the book out.

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By elliondrk 2020-06-28 16:47:02
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For the Empyrean Feet, do they only need to be worn when Divine Emblem is activated?
 Ragnarok.Lowen
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By Ragnarok.Lowen 2020-06-28 18:06:37
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They need to be on when the buff gets consumed (Ie, they need to be in your midcast for the spell), as far as I know.
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2020-06-28 20:35:25
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Ragnarok.Lowen said: »
They need to be on when the buff gets consumed (Ie, they need to be in your midcast for the spell), as far as I know.
You'd think, right? This actually came up a few months ago, and I tested it, expecting that to be the case. Turns out, not so much.

The discussion was in discord, or I'd just link it. So here's a image.


Decided to take the time to make a text version in case something happens to the image hosting. I figure I'll link the wiki references here.
Text version.
And really, this is a good thing. You can cast in more enmity/HP on the feet, and don't need any wonky code to flash in Chev feet with DE up. But jeez is SE inconsistent.

And now I'm going to go update some wiki's with notes about this, like I should have done 2 months ago.

EDIT: BG wiki pages updated.
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 Siren.Kyte
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By Siren.Kyte 2020-06-28 20:42:35
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The DRK AF3 legs are the same way for Nether Void activation.
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 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2020-06-28 21:23:58
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So I was thinking about the upcoming PLD update and Divine Emblem...

Divine Emblem needs the same change Saboteur got. Make it so that it's not consumed by casting a divine spell and just stays up for the full minute duration. <,<

Although, with only one worthwhile spell to cast during it... Feels like it would be a bit wasted compared to how well RDM makes use of Saboteur. Need Flash II or Flashga to alternate with. lol

Also need sentinel recast down to 3 minutes so the recasts sync up. /Dreams
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By zixxer 2020-06-28 22:29:08
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
Make it so that it's not consumed by casting a divine spell and just stays up for the full minute duration. <,<

I would very much enjoy this.
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2020-07-01 03:19:41
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Got some more update info.
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/56995?p=628779#post628779
Quote:
First up are job adjustments, which for this version update are centered on paladins.
The first adjustment is to Protect spells, which will now have increased effects when used by a paladin and can target players in an area of effect under certain circumstances. The second adjustment comes to Reprisal, which now provides an even further increased blocking chance against monsters of equal or higher level.
I hope they just straight up tell us how the reprisal thing works, or I'll be shield testing for the rest of eternity trying to figure it out... Curious as to how it's going to work. Higher multiplier on EM+? Or a flat block+? And would it scale up, helping us maintain similar block rates vs higher level mobs, or just be the same on anything EM+? Lots of questions.

The protect thing.. Another step toward being a WHM. <,< They gave us protectra, without actually giving us protectra. Just like they gave us curaga, without actaully giving us the spell. And after the merit spell changes robbed WHM of their higher potency protect... Now PLD gets it.

Well, if they're gonna give us protectra, then need to do shellra too. lol. Next up, adding a all na spell and erase effect to those AoE cures. PLD for main healer, yo.

I'm curious about the "increased effect" on protect as well. Most likely just more def+. Gonna need to be a lot of def to make much difference though.

Not at all what I was expecting. Interesting, but I'm still holding out for more.. They explained two changes, but the To-do list has 3 items...
Quote:
July Paladin ・Add new job traits
・Adjust certain job abilities
・Adjust certain spells -
So, unless the "new Trait" or JA adjustments cause the changes to protect and reprisal... both of those changes could fall under Adjust certain spells.

So we might still have 2 unknown changes upcoming. One trait related, and one JA related.

EDIT: Thinking about it...
Quote:
The first adjustment is to Protect spells, which will now have increased effects when used by a paladin and can target players in an area of effect under certain circumstances
Those "certain circumstances" are almost 99% certain to be with majesty up. So that's probably the "JA adjustment". Reprisal change is part of the spell adjustment. I guess the enhanced protect effect could be part of that as well, or the new trait could cause that...

Anyway, while I approve of more block rate and better defense, I can't help but feel the currently described changes have rather missed the point. Although, I guess letting the PLD buff the party defensively is a utility upgrade. Just a question of how useful it's actually going to be if it's just some extra def+.

But again... Flashga, {Where!?} Maybe we'll still get some JA timers reduced as well?
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 Shiva.Flowen
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By Shiva.Flowen 2020-07-01 03:55:00
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If the adjustment to job abilities is majesty makes flash aoe and the new trait is fencer V we might still be OK lol
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2020-07-01 08:01:53
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
I hope they just straight up tell us how the reprisal thing works, or I'll be shield testing for the rest of eternity trying to figure it out... Curious as to how it's going to work. Higher multiplier on EM+? Or a flat block+? And would it scale up, helping us maintain similar block rates vs higher level mobs, or just be the same on anything EM+? Lots of questions.
This is SE we are talking about. We all know it's going to be a straight block rate+ increase if mob procs T+. It will be static, no matter what the level is. Meaning it's going to be same Block Rate +X on ilvl 120 mobs and ilvl 150 mobs. The only difference you will be able to tell the difference between is the increased levels reduce the overall block rate.

Ragnarok.Martel said: »
Well, if they're gonna give us protectra, then need to do shellra too. lol.
If the "increase to Protect effects" is only +5 defense x level of Protect (aka Protect V = +25 defense), I will be seriously pissed off.

Also, they won't give us Shellra ability, that's next month and only going to RUN.

Ragnarok.Martel said: »
So we might still have 2 unknown changes upcoming. One trait related, and one JA related.
FENCER!
 Phoenix.Mikumaru
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By Phoenix.Mikumaru 2020-07-01 09:40:07
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It's obvious that Majesty is going affect Protect. The reprisal thing seems interesting but I agree that unless they tell us, testing testing testing. Adding new traits, adjusting certain abilities and adjusting certain spells has potential. They already told us 2 spells and hint at one ability. Maybe another Shield trait or even Gift that augments either Shield Mastery or Shield Defense Bonus. I was really hoping Majesty's adjustments were going to be a longer duration and either an Ispiration like Fast Cast or additional enmity bonus, but I suppose as long as they dont nerf it, what ever they add is good or indifferent.
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By Bismarck.Rwolf 2020-07-01 10:24:19
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I gotta say the last thing I was expecting for Majesty to work on next was Protect. It's interesting they said effects as plural so I'm wondering if more than 1 addition. I have a feeling it's going to be more -Damage Taken. I have hope they aren't silly enough to add small amounts of +Def in 2020.
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By Pandemonium.Zeto 2020-07-01 11:00:49
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
Got some more update info.

Well, if they're gonna give us protectra, then need to do shellra too. lol. Next up, adding a all na spell and erase effect to those AoE cures. PLD for main healer, yo.

I'm curious about the "increased effect" on protect as well. Most likely just more def+. Gonna need to be a lot of def to make much difference though.

It's prolly def+ 2(prot lvl) or something silly. As nice as more def is, we usually get small baby numbers instead of enough to actually make a difference like you alluded.

The block rate I hope is worth a damn. They could just make shield mastery and block rate+ work like inquartata but I guess that'd be too hard and/or OP. After all, parrying only makes you take no damage and in some cases heals you for a bit while blocking you still get punched in the face.

Oh well time to get ready for the PLD VU4 hype/disappointment train. Although at this point, I don't even get hyped anymore, just somehow more disappointed.
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By Asura.Highwynn 2020-07-01 11:40:33
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Wonder if they will do something similar for RUN next patch, but with Shell line.
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By swordwiz 2020-07-01 11:48:40
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Asura.Highwynn said: »
Wonder if they will do something similar for RUN next patch, but with Shell line.
holy ***i thought you were dead high
 Asura.Nuance
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By Asura.Nuance 2020-07-01 13:05:52
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I’m kind of the mind of hoping for a PDT effect on pld protect like shell already gets for mdt would allow a bit of flexibility in gear sets.
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By Seraphpdh 2020-07-01 15:01:31
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Does anyone know if Caballarius gauntlets +3 have a better dispel than Caballarius gauntlets +2? Both just say 'Shield Bash: "Dispel"'. It seems hard to test since there is no message in the chat log on the success of the dispel or what buff was removed.
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2020-07-01 15:39:04
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I would be very surprised if there was any difference. But I'd be even more surprised if there was actually any conclusive testing on it. Cause yeah, testing with no dispel log message... Maybe the lack of a message for that should be reported to SE as a bug? lol
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By Odin.Seraphpdh 2020-07-01 16:22:00
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
Maybe the lack of a message for that should be reported to SE as a bug? lol
I'm trying to think of any other case where an additional effect does not appear in the log, and currently cannot think of one...
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By Wotasu 2020-07-01 16:24:23
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I just finished my Burtgang and got it to R15, and I must say so far im impressed how Atonement keeps hate on Dynamis NM's. I have yet to try w3 stuff aside from Nin NM which did good until the 99999 mijin c.c;...
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-07-01 16:24:49
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Additional effect is a mixed bag.

Additional effect on weapons, shows up.
Additional effect on weaponskills do not.
Additional effect on magic does not.

Do any additional effect dispel weapons say "1 effect dispelled"?

Balmung, lockheart, mesyoi sword, ushenzshi, nullis
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