Sigurd's Descendants: The Art Of Dragon Slaying.

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Sigurd's Descendants: The Art of Dragon Slaying.
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 Odin.Creaucent
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By Odin.Creaucent 2021-02-22 07:34:52
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eliroo said: »
malakef said: »
Your assuming you get it’s defense down to 1k there and that may not happen for several reasons. It’s much harder to cap attack there then people are letting on for things like drakes. Your 6k attack is woefully short actually.

Even with Dia, Frailty, Angon?

That can't be too unreasonable. Plus they said 6k attack in idle it is most likely higher with a WS set on.

Yes my WS sets have higher attack than my idle. I just happened to be looking at something equiped for someone on discord and noticed attack at over 6k. I didnt bother checking while we were fighting the W3 boss because winning the parse is a thing.
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By Ozaii 2021-02-22 07:38:36
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Does that ammo slot from oddesy now beat other options once its augmented for stardiver and drakes? Lower str but da.
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By SimonSes 2021-02-22 07:54:34
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eliroo said: »
SimonSes said: »
eliroo said: »
Yeah it sounds like its definitely something you would toggle on and off in your gearswap based on circumstance, I assume a toggle would have been beneficial before gleti anyway considering Fotia vs. JSE neck.

After this patch, I added .Att mode in my lua for all my WSs on DNC and THF (so far, but its will be on many more jobs) for attack capped situation :P

Are you doing any calculations within the lua for that or is it just a manual toggle?

Manual
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By malakef 2021-02-22 08:06:59
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Yeah the point I was wanting to make about it being tougher than you think even with 6k In Dynamis is one the frailty nerf but two you really need to make sure your group has probably 3 forms of defense down on the target there to make sure you hitting that cap. It’s certainly possible but in all honestly you probably only apply all three forms consistently in just the wave 2 and 3 bosses and maybe the NM in wave 3. Everything else dies too fast to bother with there.

The other thing is what someone mention about Gaol NM’s and the likely hood of not having enough defense down or attack buff combo. You certainly could have it but it’s also very likely you don’t. I think we need to introduce a new gear set thats a midpoint between uncapped and capped where you have enough attack to support a partial PDL build but not the full thing. Much like we often have three levels of accuracy builds in our Lua’s.

Also bring a BST for that lovely 33% defense down.
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By eliroo 2021-02-22 08:17:13
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malakef said: »
Also bring a BST for that lovely 33% defense down.

Genuinely surprised BST isn't bandwagoned yet. Their debuffs are pretty good.
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By SimonSes 2021-02-22 08:52:01
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eliroo said: »
malakef said: »
Also bring a BST for that lovely 33% defense down.

Genuinely surprised BST DNC isn't bandwagoned yet. Their debuffs and buffs are pretty good insane for Gaol.

FTFY

Box step is -23% def, while BST 33% is only 8% above most def down debuffs provided with WS, spells and abilities. Also Haste Samba is more useful than ever, when WAR cant sub Dual Wield or Hasso.
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By SimonSes 2021-02-22 09:12:34
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Ragnarok.Martel said: »
SimonSes said: »
Ragnarok.Martel said: »
At 1k def it would take 5,300 atk to cap for non crits. And the sheet has some Apex mobs listed at over 1400~ def. And WoC at 1950. Though I don't know how accurate those values are. But you'd best work that defense down and hope there's no geo resistance.

Point is, that while this new gear is powerful under the right conditions, you'd better be damn sure you are meeting those conditions first. And that's even harder with drakes due to that god damned atk penalty.

5300? With +45%PDL pdif caps at 5.8725, not 5.3, so 5873 attack.
With Drakesbane att penalty its 7227 attack
Mmmmm. So it is. Pardon my 2AM napkin math.

Yep, 2AM is usually when math starts to be a problem for me too XD

One more thing tho, you said for "non crits". I dont think there is difference in ratio cap for crits and non crits? You actually got me thinking..

so I went and tested it..

and the formula for crit ratio cap with PDL is not (normal cap+1)*PDL, but (normal cap*PDL)+1.

*** I need to change all my sheets now >.>
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By Ozaii 2021-02-28 13:00:06
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Does stinger helm beat gletis mask for stardiver? In an atk capped set?
 Ragnarok.Martel
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By Ragnarok.Martel 2021-02-28 13:16:39
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As it turns out... sometimes, yes.

If attack is uncapped, both Gleti's and Stinger+1 get stomped on by Ptero+3.

But if attack is sufficiently overcapped then R15 Stinger +1 can come out ahead when your unity rank is high enough to be providing at least 1 STR above the minimum value. Sadly I have no idea what rank you have to be for that. And while it is ahead, it's not massively so. It's a decent bit ahead. Roughly 300 dmg per ws, at unity rank 1. About 70 dmg ahead at +4 total STR from the unity stat.

Also, thing to note. Stinger +1 has no atk. At all. So it is not helping you get to that overcapped state at all. Gleti's has +40 atk natively, and can be augmented with more. So if you are going to use Stinger, make sure you are waaaay over capped.
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By Ozaii 2021-03-09 23:55:32
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Love that drg gets a malignance esque set. Finally!
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2021-03-10 01:00:03
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STP/PDL or WSD/DA augment variants.
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By Andromida 2021-03-14 17:11:44
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I am trying out Retribution as a blunt damage for Odyssey farming this is the set I have been trying:

ItemSet 378686

I am quite impressed in both Dynamis W1 and 2 and on Apex Jagils. On the Jagils with trusts Jochim, Arciela, Ulmia, Yoran-Oran and Qultada averaging of 12299 with 70 samples. Seeing about 9k at 1000TP and 20k at full TP.

I am also wondering about Cataclysm with the Nyame set. Anyone had a look if it is viable?
 Asura.Bippin
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By Asura.Bippin 2021-03-14 17:44:22
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Using this for Cata right now, don't think anything has been replaced w/o augments but I would love info that I am wrong.
Hands have 44 MAB and using Reikikon
Path B nyame should replace just about everything but head

Edit: Also for Retribution Epaminondas's Ring and Metamor. Ring +1 should be better when attack is capped
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By Andromida 2021-03-15 13:34:49
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Thanks for the suggestion with those rings, will have to get hold of them :)
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By SimonSes 2021-03-15 14:18:40
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Why Retribution when Shattersoul is better? Unless you dont have room to merit it I guess.
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2021-03-15 14:42:10
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Andromida said: »
I am trying out Retribution as a blunt damage for Odyssey farming this is the set I have been trying:

How much damage are you seeing in Odyssey vs bones?
 Bismarck.Ringoko
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By Bismarck.Ringoko 2021-03-15 15:01:32
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SimonSes said: »
Why Retribution when Shattersoul is better? Unless you dont have room to merit it I guess.

I just unlocked it for funsies on SCH. Didn't consider making a set for DRG until now. What kind of numbers are you seeing?
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By SimonSes 2021-03-15 15:16:42
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Bismarck.Ringoko said: »
SimonSes said: »
Why Retribution when Shattersoul is better? Unless you dont have room to merit it I guess.

I just unlocked it for funsies on SCH. Didn't consider making a set for DRG until now. What kind of numbers are you seeing?

Im not seeing anything because I havent tried it :D I just looked it up for the same reason (I was checking blunt options) in sheet few days ago and it was better than Retribution. I think it was around 17-18k at 1000TP+, when Retribution was around 13k.

EDIT: I was checking at attack cap with gleti's tho (vs Retribution at attack cap and Gelti's). With uncapped attack they might be close, because of Retribution native +50% attack bonus.
 Asura.Bippin
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By Asura.Bippin 2021-03-15 15:19:05
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Even with 25 merits now, I still don't have room for Shattersoul. I guess maybe I could remove star driver and give it a shot. If anyone has been using it would love to hear about it.

Edit: Would love to see some sets as well.
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By Andromida 2021-03-22 13:49:56
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
How much damage are you seeing in Odyssey vs bones?

I have been seeing over 20k but I have been making improvements so I would expect it to be even better now

SimonSes said: »
Why Retribution when Shattersoul is better? Unless you dont have room to merit it I guess.

Partly because I'm not familiar enough with staff to have thought about the merit WS xD I'll have to look at my merits and see if I can have a play. I'm not completely sure how to gear for it, can I just transfure over my Retribution set or does it need something specific? The INT modifier is interesting
 Fenrir.Skarwind
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By Fenrir.Skarwind 2021-03-22 14:47:03
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Andromida said: »
Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
How much damage are you seeing in Odyssey vs bones?

I have been seeing over 20k but I have been making improvements so I would expect it to be even better now

SimonSes said: »
Why Retribution when Shattersoul is better? Unless you dont have room to merit it I guess.

Partly because I'm not familiar enough with staff to have thought about the merit WS xD I'll have to look at my merits and see if I can have a play. I'm not completely sure how to gear for it, can I just transfure over my Retribution set or does it need something specific? The INT modifier is interesting


Get both?


SHATTERSOUL > RETRIBUTION (FRAGMENTATION)

The INT mod is a pain. You can always just stack either Multi Attack or PDL if attack is capped.

If you ever overflow on tp because of a jump, Full Swing also has 5 ftp at 3000tp.

Heres a really stupid one.
SHATTERSOUL > FULL SWING (IMPACTION) > FULL SWING (LIQUEFACTION) > FULL SWING (FUSION) > SHATTERSOUL (GRAVITATION)

DRG does have enough raw WSDMG gear/trait to make Full Swing/Retribution decent-ish.

It still isnt as impressive as club/h2h sadly
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By Ozaii 2021-03-23 09:10:59
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What would a good shatter soil set even look like. Imagine alot of stuff you use for stardiver. Would it be all gleits if you were capping atk though.
 Siren.Kyten
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By Siren.Kyten 2021-04-10 20:55:12
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How do Trish / Ryu stack up against each other these days at R15?
 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2021-04-10 21:37:09
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Trish > Ryu, probably. I imagine the gap closed a bit in situations where Gleti's can be used to it's full potential.

Ryu also, probably, loses the least from swapping in Nayame pieces for meva shenanigans.
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By SimonSes 2021-04-11 02:29:31
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Ryu wins at attack cap from raw dps perspective (damage without self skillchaining), but attack cap with Gleti and Drake's is practically only possible with geo in events where geomancy isn't nerfed or with dnc doing box step on top of angon and dia III.

That being said, Shining One beats both at attack cap :P I'm surprised none realized this already? Gleti's has amazing synergy with Shining One and it has some ridiculous avg damage if you hold tp to ~2500, that makes even 3000tp Torcleavers looks like NIN ws lol. It can spike to 99k and avg around 72k XD
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 Asura.Veikur
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By Asura.Veikur 2021-04-11 10:15:54
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Haven't been playing, or had much in the way of free time for months.

I'll have to check the math out, that sounds pretty damn cool.
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By Veydal1 2021-04-11 19:03:46
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Trish is great if you can make use of the aftermath and make Umbras. Ryu is nuts to play with when you're actually in a position where you have enough attack & the mob has enough HP to make it worthwhile (for AM purposes). However, that being said, both seem to fall short of Shining One + Impulse Drive when:
1. You're not able to cap attack sufficiently so that Drakesbane doesn't hit for garbage damage
2. You can't make use of Umbra

Shining One is just extremely powerful in practice and synergizes well with DRG's amazing TP gain. I admittedly don't have Trish R15, but I do have Ryu R15. I can't say I'm in any rush to R15 Trish, though, I definitely see the value if found myself in the position to make use of SCs more often.
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By Veydal1 2021-04-11 19:21:10
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SimonSes said: »
Ryu wins at attack cap from raw dps perspective (damage without self skillchaining), but attack cap with Gleti and Drake's is practically only possible with geo in events where geomancy isn't nerfed or with dnc doing box step on top of angon and dia III.

That being said, Shining One beats both at attack cap :P I'm surprised none realized this already? Gleti's has amazing synergy with Shining One and it has some ridiculous avg damage if you hold tp to ~2500, that makes even 3000tp Torcleavers looks like NIN ws lol. It can spike to 99k and avg around 72k XD

It's definitely something I haven't seen brought up often at all. Like you said, it does require you to hold TP, HOWEVER, TP generation is not something DRG struggles with. I feel like the WS frequency pulls ahead in practice for fights long enough to make full use of though.
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By Phoenix.Luxxord 2021-04-14 21:06:13
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Could someone post BIS Savage blade TP/WS sets? Thanks :)
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