Borealis VS Caladbolg(90)

That still doesn't change the fact that they're not the same stat, and shouldn't exactly be compared as such.

Are you seriously just bitching about it being slightly inaccurate?

They are the same stat mechanically: A percentage-chanced multiplier of damage.

Yes I am.

One is a multiplier and one is an addition to a function. One also only applies to the first hit of a round and the other does not. Saying x% crit = x% ODD is still a terrible idea, unless you're stating something like "against this target and stats, they are comparable."

It's about context. You're talking about a different context. Taint is using a metric of damage multiplication native to the weapon.

It's a way to compare the weapons in their basic states. It's the same way you place damage against delay to produce the DPS metric. You wouldn't say DPS is an invalid metric just because you haven't yet considered hitbuilds, gear, or other buffs being given.

It is a way to compare the weapons themselves.

It's a reference, a guide. It tells us that Rag at least matches the ODD of Caladbolg in native damage multiplication, albeit through a secondary stat.

But that's just the thing: It is a valid comparison in this context. If you double-dipped the crit bonus (using the ODD equivalence and calculating crit rate) or something it'd be invalid, sure.

But they're damage multipliers, and this is fifth grade math to put them together so you can compare the weapons on a basic level. You're making a case similar to saying a 'DPS' value from damage and delay is irrelevant or invalid because Haste values and hitbuilds may vary, see?

No, I'm saying X% crit = X% ODD is not an accurate statement, because it's not always going to be that way. Taint understood it, why you're having such a difficult time and trying to put words in my mouth, that's what I don't think anyone understands.

Correct me if I'm wrong (and it's entirely possible as my only DD empy is Almace which I've used once) but can't Empy ODD proc on multihits whereas Relic can only proc on the first swing? So comparing the two is already shaky if so.

I'm not entirely sure for non H2H ones, which can only proc on the first swing on an attack round.

Spharai and the mythic h2h can only proc on the first hit with the main hand, where as Calad and other empy aftermath can strike on any hit in an attack round from what i've seen. I have 90 Calad, 90 Vere, 85 hvergelmir, and 85 kannagi, as well as my 99 ragnarok.

with an appropriate build, torcleaver can be pretty hot stuff, easily countered by a reso with an appropriate build. one thing i do with ragnarok, is sekkanoki scourge to reso for the added light chain damage.

I've pit my calad against a borealis, and calad came out on top, just using torcleaver while the other drk used reso. had similar gear, he used a 6 hit while i used a 7 hit, with a focus on DA to make up for the difference in xhit. The aftermath alone, along with a str/vit/att setup completely ruined him in parse

Ragnarok's 2.5 damage proc can't proc on 2nd hit of a Double Attack? That's pretty huge if true.

So much stupid in this tread.

Says the guy with a 99cala ROTFLMAO....

Would love to see you justify 99Cala over 99Rag.

So far all you posted was a lol and the above comment. Now that's proof of superior intelligence, right? Right ;P

Pretty sure it's the case for all relics.

yup

I think Vere is an exception though, due to the weirdness with H2H multiattacks.

Exception for Bow and Gun which can proc on a double shot.

Ya that's why it surprised me. Only relic I have is gun and double shot works great :).

Really think this fact solidifies Calads dominance over Ragnarok on non-evasive content.

But due to the absolute need of AM3, it would only be viable in VW, I would think.

The more and more it is shown how Caladbolg 99 can shine, the less and less it looks appealing.

Anything lasting less than three minutes where you can build TP beforehand arguably qualifies, though Sekkanoki is potentially a counter-consideration for extremely short fights.

Wouldn't it be better to math out for the OP how the damage defers between the borialis and Cala? i'm interested as i'm assuming the op wont ever make a rag and is planning on stopping cala at 90. I think he was actually looking for some usefull info so he knew wether to waste time doing Ig or CC's
edit: i just read that meme it's sad but so true lol

^ This

And it would take a lot of ODD to over come a single extra Resolution.

Not even mentioned is the fact WAR can use Rag which opens a whole new tier of endgame damage potential.

90Cala is likely easier and faster to obtain.

90Cala
+ODD
Torcleavor for Light if applicable
Fast and easy to make

Borealis
8% proc 50% WS boost
480 delay easy 6hit

The simple answer is start making Cala90 its a very quick path, chances are you'll never get a Borealis. If I had to bet on a weapon I'm taking Cala90 and its superior white damage over Borealis.

Night, you know I love you man, but sometimes you worry me. If you're /saming to a zerg you are doing it wrong.

This is still going on?! Make OAT or Ragnarok and be done with it. D:

I distinctly remember using the words "potentially" and "Sekkanoki". It was far from a blanket statement regarding use of the two subs in a zerg. That said don't overestimate the difference between the two subs when Bergressor isn't in play, particularly if you're getting buffs that favor /SAM (Boost-STR, Fighter's Roll).

Pretty much what Night said. And if you were talking about a pure zerg which was standalone then the Rag user should be going WAR anyway.

/sam for very fast fights like ADL or with fighters

/war for the rest

So wait we're back to /sam is the way to go on most things?

I'm not sarcastic at all. :)

If you don't need acc or attack benefits or aggressor, or berserk youre just getting DA. There's not really a "this always wins". That being said i am of the opinion that with all the new relics every 20 seconds and drks attack so HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE high now (with LR 71% of the time) it never was much of a choice.

With borealis you can make a 5 hit

For Legion at the least, you will still need aggressor to cap Accuracy even with relic, and SE or DE on Harpi.