Suggestions For PLD

Beefing up PLD's dmg output to be on par with current DDs isn't going to come from the devs.
While I'm sure PLD/NIN and PLD/SAM properly geared could potentially be efficient DDs, this isn't the intended role for PLD.
So lets humor SE and offer some suggestions on what PLD currently is missing to be able to retain some sort of slot in an alliance.

Right now there are no real Job specific benefits offered by PLD other than Sepulcher, which will probably turn out to be laughable.

Some additions to PLD that would not be game breaking.

1. Divine Aura : - 25 % PDT , - 25% MDT, Regen (20HP/tick) Attack -25%, accuracy -25%, evasion -25% for pt members.
Duration 3 minutes, cool down 5 minutes

the next 3 are the seigan/hasso, yonnin/innin of PLD. (yes 3 stances)

Duration 2 minutes, cool down 2 minutes.

2.Intimidating stance: Melee attacks slow +25%, Fast Cast +25%, Raises Enmity cap to 200% for PLD, doubles CE/VE values on all spells. Reduces cool down time on Sentinel and Rampart. (-1 minute on each)


3.Holy stance -Cure potency +50%, Healing Magic delays -50%, Healing Magic Mp consumption +50%.
Grants access to additional White Magic spells. (CureV, Curaga1 & 2)

4.Iron wall Stance - Melee Slow +90%, defense +50%, vit +50, shield proc rate +25%. Reduces recast time on Shield Bash, Reprisal and Augments Cover effect (Cover becomes Aoe, coverga)

Wishful thinking is an understatement. But with the above, PLD would never go emo again lol.

inb4 "lol pld is useless"

damn you're like the Flash and Quicksilver of forum trolls!

Will never happen and for the most part not that good that wouldnt come close to fixing pld

Its happened before.

Shield Mastery - Sentinel Buff - Rampart Buff - Reprisal - Flash hate increase - These are all JA/Traits/Spells that did not exist, OR did not exist as they do today not so long ago (4 years?)

SE WILL address paladin's decline. The only questions are when, and how they will go about fixing it. It took them about 2 years to finally fix it last time (2006). Judging by how desperate they are to retain as many customers as possible in FFXI, and how they're tossing out the chocolate chip cookied atmas, it wont take more than 6 months this time.

To fix PLD, you'd need to increase its damage (not its ability to hold hate). PLD isn't used much because DD's can hold hate and do better damage (seriously, with the Refresh available today, there's no real need for Sentinel/Rampart/etc).

Those stances sound to much like something a class in WoW would get, so I dont think we'r ever gonna get something with that much boosts in this game D:
Would be epic, but probably wont ever happen >_<

Pld is NOT useless and will never be useless, SE will continue to fix them as they fix up every job. People are just always DD happy morons that are noobs... These ideas however would never do, they need other things, however there are still many things out there that we can do to help that we just haven't tried yet.

Half of all that is going to make PLD even worse than it is now. If you want to fix pld, w/o fixing the game mechanics(b/c its not going to happen) then you have to fix what pld is lacking. What it is lacking in todays way of doing things is damage. The 2nd would be taking damage.

Shield and sword, its to take damage and dish it out. PLD isnt doing any of those at this current moment. Well, I should reword it, pld isnt doing any of those enough to *warrant* a spot in the party.

Now giving pld uber attack power just like that would be unbalanced as far as how jobs are, ie berserk/hasso/souleater type of JAs but at the same time I dont think it would be broken if it was given a few JAs that let it convert damage from enmity and damage it recieves. That means the more its tanking the more damage its dealing giving pld a better potential than it currently has.

All those JAs you are giving pld with -melee Slow % or -acc/att is hurting pld more than the positive part is helping.

Apart from the damage pld isnt dealing, its also recieving more than it should. All DD jobs have as much access to all of a PLDs damage armor if not more. IMO, creed+2 legs are a model of what exclusive pld gear should of looked like. -pdt% + a good chunk of hp and haste. Make shield blocking % higher, make shield skill gear worth more and who knows it could of brought back blood tanking.

Having 40-50% damage taken gear, maybe another rampart/sentinel type of JA, while maintaining full haste/att/acc gear with a damage convert JA and I think pld would be more ideal for a few fights.

I dont think anyone wants to hear it or see it, but pld is going to have to pump out damage in some form so that its not broken ,but comparable to be able to tank against wars nins mnks. Theres no other way a pld will be useful if it cant.

Yeah I actually looked to WoW's take on PLD style tanking vs WAR.
Both tanks are extremely viable in WoW, and some are specific to different raids/instances. None overshadow the other.
SE is actually taking a lot of cues from Blizzard these days. It is possible they will implement something of this magnitude for the job.

Also to the other poster who said they are horrible ideas; Ever heard the saying "It's not a problem unless you have a solution" ?
Please, offer your "better" ideas instead of just criticizing mine.

Fighters Stance
Attack increases by 50%
Accuracy increases by 30
Critical Hit Rate increases by 15%
Critical Hit Damage increases by 5%
Haste effect +5%

Defence decreases by 50%
Evasion decreases by 30
VIT decreases by (level / 9)
AGI decreases by (level / 9)



Warriors Hold
Enmity Cap increases by 50%
Volatile Enmity Generation increases by 50%
Cumulative Enmity Generation increases by 25%



Defenders Fortress
Damage Taken -25%
Augments "Reprisal" (Damage taken -5%)
Occasionally annuls damage taken (~5% proc)
Slow effect +5%

I disagree. The abilities I listed intentionally reduced PLD's ability to DD while gaining more survivability and hate.

If melee could continue to do what they do, while also shedding hate through the participation of PLD and consequently gaining increased survivability and the dmg output, everyone would gladly grant PLD a spot in alliance.
A solid, lasting and efficient focal point for hate is what PLD is meant to be, not a top tier dd with cures.

Not bad, but Fighter's stance would cause everyone to abandon every other job and we would have alliances of PLDs only.
You realize that a well geared PLD with the right atma set is only parsing 5-15% lower than parse leaders? And I'm not talking gimp pts either. Relics/Empyreans.

Also, PLD doesn't need anymore dmg mitigation from reprisal. As it stands now, if you're taking heavy dmg from blocked attacks, then something is wrong.

Agreed. In old endgame, Melee wouldn't last long vs end game NMs.
The reason Melee have more survivability today is due to
1. Increased player awareness and skill. Both Melee and Healers today player bases are better skilled.

2.Utsusemi and Seigan - Really should have remained job specific abilities/spells.

Considering point 2, SE could release NMs that hit through shadows 100% of the time, and attack too fast and frequently for Seigan/Third eye to be viable.

It's time for PLDs all over the game to obtain their unique Weaponskill, Shield Bash!



Wack 'em in the face!

I'd be plenty happy with them changing the enmity modification for level. We keep going up in levels which is lovely but the hate plds get for cure kits is less now and from 75-90 pld has not gotten near enough to improve our cure ability to counter the degrade in enmity gain.

Flash 2 or flashga would be marvels.

A job trait that resists hate resets... Most new mobs have some kind of hate reset which usually results in dd's being able to take and keep hate better.

Stop *** atonement damage... Is there really any reason to make 90% of all nms added to the game now resist atonement?

Many of the ideas listed previously are trade offs. The thing is, pld doesn't need trade offs. Our dd is already abysmal at best and we can't keep hate. Lowering our defenses in order to deal damage so we can keep hate? At this point, your better off leveling a dd.

Screwing up /rdm was a particularly stupid idea. I know SE was trying to stop rdms from tanking but it really hurt pld and nin just as much.

There's a million options to fix pld, the issue is they need to be able to do something others can't and that should be keeping hate and having the ability to survive when others can't. That is what pld is suppose to be and that is what needs to be addressed.

Your ideas are awful.
My better idea would be leaving it as is. As useless as PLD is now, those abilities would make it worse.

Why would a Paladin want Cure V to help with tanking?

25% drop in acc and att? Give them all the PDT/MDT you want, they aren't holding hate on anything you can melee.
Slow +90%? Seriously?

The only think mildly interesting is the increase in enmity one. Which has been suggested already countless times. A trait that increase max values/accumulation rate for CE/VE would be a good start for Pld.

Edit: What Sekundes said above my post was quite insightful.

I'm sorry but as Shiroi has stated and I have aswell, DDs have the same damage reduction and survivability as a pld. No one will care if a pld starts taking 50% less damage now than DDs do because there isnt a mob in the current endgame that requires it.

All ppl care about right now, is how fast a mob dies, because the faster a mob dies, the less damage they take overall. So if a pld isnt contributing to this, why are they going to want it?

And I disagree, a pld is suppose to deal damage, its given access to a sword with A+ rating, clearly it was meant to be drawn and smack the hell out of things with it, not whiff and use as a trohpy. It doesnt have to be top tier DD, it just has to produce enough damage among its DD partners to warrant a spot in this era of FF. Look at the stats on creed af3 its not stocked up with vitality and def, its loaded with haste/-damage taken stats along with acc/att/str. Thats what pld is suppose to do, take damage *better* than any job and dish out *reasonable* damage along with using any tools to fill in the gaps, thats what a pld should be.

Just give pld something like accomplice / collaborator.

make it take a portion of the entire party's hate

give it a 1 min reuse timer


other than that i dont see how pld will become any more relevant

I doubt they'd do it, but I'd be quite happy with this.

Making cover a self targeted ability that lasted 1 min rather than a few seconds and would work on everyone and anyone behind you with relation to the mob would also be lovely. Making it stop AoE's from hitting the target and giving pld some special effect while cover is up at the same time.

What pld needs is a repetitive hate generating "ping" ability/or trait that spams out a small amount of enmity every 5 seconds say 1/4 the amount in flash or provoke. Duration 2 min recast 5 min.

OR

A job trait that doubles emnity generated by physical attacks for a short time. Kinda like a "Divine Emblem" but for either a multiple number of attacks or a moderate duration of time.

/fixed

Dont get me wrong, i have pld leveled, i only get to use it for Omega. Wish i got to use it more often :(

The only thing that would somewhat fix PLD is giving it further -dmg abilities, and simultaneously introducing enemies that require this mitigation. As it stands, everything can be tanked by DDs, and they output more DMG. So unless they gimp DDs tanking abilities (unlikely) or do the above, PLD won't see much spotlight. Also Cure V is a pretty bad addition to PLD due to it's enmity cap. I don't even

The way they made the cure line of spells was for 75, cure V was never intended to be given to any other job but, SE can simply give a new line of spells to other jobs that still need a better curing method.

They could give a 'cure v' version to pld and other jobs like rdm and sch and just call it something else. It would cure a similar amount, perhaps have similar mechanics except don't cap the hate.

No. Hate caps and your suggestions don't do a damn thing about the fact that both tanks and DDs will cap within a very short time. The only way to fix PLD is to make it far more efficient to have a PLD tanking the mob. Given that survivability isn't an issue at present, two things need to happen:

1) NMs need to become way more dangerous. This has limitations, as other jobs may be as effective or better tanks at present and if they change that balance then any group without a PLD may be crippled. That is not effective job balance. This is a very tricky problem.
2) Tanking needs to function in a capacity that not only provides safety for the backline, but for the DDs. If you can create a scenario where DDs can go all-out fulltime such that it surpasses the total DPS of a non-PLD setup, you may have a viable PLD tanking scenario. This also has limitations, as allowing DDs to go all-out reduces their survivability and thus if the PLD goes down you're boned. If that occurs, you would have been better off playing defensively and then there's no incentive to bring a PLD to begin with because the benefit to DPS is not realized.

He didn't specify that. And regardless, keeping hate is not the problem (something that doesn't seem to sink in with most PLDs out there). Any job can keep hate, and most likely better than PLD, the problem comes with increments to DPS or party performance, something which PLD contributes zero to.

To contribute I would add;

1) Great Sword + Shield wielding job trait after 80+ lvls PLD (not GS dual wield) In my opinion this would let paladin to catch great balance with other jobs even with its current state, and fun as well.

2) Much more Shield Bash damage and much less recast time (very limited amount of lucky people have Aegis)

3) Repose spell please.