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Is there a point in PLD anymore?
Serveur: Shiva
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Posts: 23653
By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-27 07:03:46
Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that. Cerberus.Billgoku said: My comment was for flion, and I'm not saying I keep attention all the time, but I am saying its not that hard to keep it, or to get it back. I rarely even use sentinel, and that only against mnk mobs.
Both of these comments mean one thing:
Your shell has bad DD or you're lying.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-27 07:04:26
Simply put, in Dyna a PLD is a waste.
 Cerberus.Billgoku
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By Cerberus.Billgoku 2010-08-27 07:08:19
Shiva.Flionheart said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that. Cerberus.Billgoku said: My comment was for flion, and I'm not saying I keep attention all the time, but I am saying its not that hard to keep it, or to get it back. I rarely even use sentinel, and that only against mnk mobs.
Both of these comments mean one thing:
Your shell has bad DD or you're lying.
You are just in the mind set that plds are useless, when they're far from it. No they can't be used in everything but theres still plenty of spots they can fill. Me and the only other pld in my shell do our jobs just fine and have no complaints, the dds are great and do their jobs just fine.
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Cerberus.Billgoku
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By Cerberus.Billgoku 2010-08-27 07:09:08
Shiva.Flionheart said: Simply put, in Dyna a PLD is a waste.
If you think its a waste then I'm proud of you, but we do things our way and get ***done, you do things your way.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-27 07:10:21
Cerberus.Billgoku said: Shiva.Flionheart said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that. Cerberus.Billgoku said: My comment was for flion, and I'm not saying I keep attention all the time, but I am saying its not that hard to keep it, or to get it back. I rarely even use sentinel, and that only against mnk mobs.
Both of these comments mean one thing:
Your shell has bad DD or you're lying.
You are just in the mind set that plds are useless, when they're far from it. No they can't be used in everything but theres still plenty of spots they can fill. Me and the only other pld in my shell do our jobs just fine and have no complaints, the dds are great and do their jobs just fine.
I can think of about 3 situations where PLD would be useful.
Phoenix.Avelle
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By Phoenix.Avelle 2010-08-27 07:11:40
Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2010-08-27 07:11:52
PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
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 Cerberus.Vaness
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By Cerberus.Vaness 2010-08-27 07:15:53
Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful. I agree with this, dont have time to really use pld (beside kiting statues or nms in xarcabar?) mob dies wayyyyyy to fast.But I am in a ls where DD's are pretty godly.Maybe in smaller ls with not godly DDs, there is a use, I dunno.
Cerberus.Billgoku
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By Cerberus.Billgoku 2010-08-27 07:16:00
Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
I might be exaggerating a bit, but not much. The mob does turn away but about when he does he's dead anyway. Also dynamis mobs are a bad example anyway, after the cap increase they became weaker so comparing anything on them at this point is dumb.
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
This I agree with 100%
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-27 07:17:28
Cerberus.Billgoku said: Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
I might be exaggerating a bit, but not much. The mob does turn away but about when he does he's dead anyway. Also dynamis mobs are a bad example anyway, after the cap increase they became weaker so comparing anything on them at this point is dumb.
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
This I agree with 100%
So then, anything with a first voke can stand in for a PLD and do more dmg.
nice.
Cerberus.Vaness
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By Cerberus.Vaness 2010-08-27 07:18:23
Shiva.Flionheart said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
I might be exaggerating a bit, but not much. The mob does turn away but about when he does he's dead anyway. Also dynamis mobs are a bad example anyway, after the cap increase they became weaker so comparing anything on them at this point is dumb.
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
This I agree with 100%
So then, anything with a first voke can stand in for a PLD and do more dmg.
nice. <3 flion
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-08-27 07:19:25
I was comparing numbers from 75, I'm sure it's even worse trying to keep hate as PLD now in Dynamis. I've only done Icelands since update.
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-27 07:20:13
Cerberus.Vaness said: Shiva.Flionheart said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
I might be exaggerating a bit, but not much. The mob does turn away but about when he does he's dead anyway. Also dynamis mobs are a bad example anyway, after the cap increase they became weaker so comparing anything on them at this point is dumb.
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
This I agree with 100%
So then, anything with a first voke can stand in for a PLD and do more dmg.
nice. <3 flion
<3 BRD BUDDY!
Cerberus.Vaness
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Posts: 1515
By Cerberus.Vaness 2010-08-27 07:22:56
Shiva.Flionheart said: Cerberus.Vaness said: Shiva.Flionheart said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
I might be exaggerating a bit, but not much. The mob does turn away but about when he does he's dead anyway. Also dynamis mobs are a bad example anyway, after the cap increase they became weaker so comparing anything on them at this point is dumb.
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
This I agree with 100%
So then, anything with a first voke can stand in for a PLD and do more dmg.
nice. <3 flion
<3 BRD BUDDY! =DD
Phoenix.Avelle
Serveur: Phoenix
Game: FFXI
Posts: 179
By Phoenix.Avelle 2010-08-27 07:24:55
Cerberus.Billgoku said: Phoenix.Avelle said: Cerberus.Billgoku said: Our shell does the job just fine without any problems. If you know how to manage hate control, very rarely will any dd pull hate. Kids like you out there do not understand how to do that.
When monsters go 100 to dead in a matter of seconds, there's no conceivable way a paladin will hold hate unless he's been holding the mob for a long time just spamming abilities and curecheats on it, which isn't possible for every mob in dynamis. You're either exaggerating or your dd are awful.
I might be exaggerating a bit, but not much. The mob does turn away but about when he does he's dead anyway. Also dynamis mobs are a bad example anyway, after the cap increase they became weaker so comparing anything on them at this point is dumb.
Ifrit.Kungfuhustle said: PLD isnt useless at all. NIN is useless. Fact.
This I agree with 100%
I'm not even talking post level update. Dynamis has been a total joke for a long time now. You can think whatever you want, but DD's are the true tanks in events like Dynamis. You can have a PLD hold NMs in Xarc or fulfill some kind of variation of that role, but the second the DD alliance is on it your job is done. There aren't enough cooldowns, MP, or +enmity in the world that will change that fact.
 Bismarck.Barrd
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By Bismarck.Barrd 2010-08-27 07:32:56
Ifrit.Eikechi said: In most situations without a thf, plds couldn't hold ***for years.... lol I have bird merited with GK with an Aegis pld with like +40 enmity in gear and he still couldn't do much to hold hate inb4: lulwat GK on birds... ya ya, point remains valid lol.
pld i not made to hold fast exp mob hate thay are for hold 1 mob for log base of time to make it eazyer for ppl to dd and cast magic on it give a pld min on a mob and there no way you will pull hate
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By Shiva.Flionheart 2010-08-27 07:34:26
Bismarck.Barrd said: Ifrit.Eikechi said: In most situations without a thf, plds couldn't hold ***for years.... lol I have bird merited with GK with an Aegis pld with like +40 enmity in gear and he still couldn't do much to hold hate inb4: lulwat GK on birds... ya ya, point remains valid lol.
pld i not made to hold fast exp mob hate thay are for hold 1 mob for log base of time to make it eazyer for ppl to dd and cast magic on it give a pld min on a mob and there no way you will pull hate 
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By Ifrit.Kungfuhustle 2010-08-27 07:36:46
Shiva.Flionheart said: Bismarck.Barrd said: Ifrit.Eikechi said: In most situations without a thf, plds couldn't hold ***for years.... lol I have bird merited with GK with an Aegis pld with like +40 enmity in gear and he still couldn't do much to hold hate inb4: lulwat GK on birds... ya ya, point remains valid lol.
pld i not made to hold fast exp mob hate thay are for hold 1 mob for log base of time to make it eazyer for ppl to dd and cast magic on it give a pld min on a mob and there no way you will pull hate 
 Cerberus.Tidis
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By Cerberus.Tidis 2010-08-27 07:44:15
I agree with the thing about Dynamis, I go out of the way to spam abilities and such on the MNK and RNG mobs because those can still down a DD easily but everything else really gets tanked by whoever hits hardest.
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Posts: 1848
By Asura.Rinkydink 2010-08-27 08:16:38
lol.. i read the title .. laughed.. then decided.. your HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE :D
pld is better than ever now...
my linkshell literally creamed when they read the most recent update...
by 2nd trade im a scholar.. basically i can say to my pld.. hey have more emnity and because of the new "lol mob u cant hit me" phalanx plus a variety of other items..and the new SCH JA. i can also say to my (insert insanely stupid DD), hey ill reduce ur emnity ***..
so hell yes PLD meatshielding is back in business.
why the *** would you put a dd in PDT gear when a pld in full DD gear and still take less damage and deal a similar amount (atonement etc dependant) of dmg as the dd who got gimped?
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Posts: 2328
By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-08-27 08:21:26
Every job that ever has a chance of pulling hate should have a PDT set, defense does *** all for damage reduction so the only boost PLD gets is from a shield. 50% PDT on PLD =/= 50% on another job. By that logic may as well not gear towards DDing as PLD since it's not a real DD and won't do as much damage.
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Phoenix.Avelle
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By Phoenix.Avelle 2010-08-27 08:22:49
Asura.Rinkydink said: lol.. i read the title .. laughed.. then decided.. your HELP I AM TRAPPED IN 2006 PLEASE SEND A TIME MACHINE :D
pld is better than ever now...
my linkshell literally creamed when they read the most recent update...
by 2nd trade im a scholar.. basically i can say to my pld.. hey have more emnity and because of the new "lol mob u cant hit me" phalanx plus a variety of other items..and the new SCH JA. i can also say to my (insert insanely stupid DD), hey ill reduce ur emnity ***..
so hell yes PLD meatshielding is back in business.
why the *** would you put a dd in PDT gear when a pld in full DD gear and still take less damage and deal a similar amount (atonement etc dependant) of dmg as the dd who got gimped? 
I think most of everything that has been said has been completely lost on you.
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By Caitsith.Omicronceti 2010-08-27 08:26:50
Bismarck.Barrd said: Ifrit.Eikechi said: In most situations without a thf, plds couldn't hold ***for years.... lol I have bird merited with GK with an Aegis pld with like +40 enmity in gear and he still couldn't do much to hold hate inb4: lulwat GK on birds... ya ya, point remains valid lol.
pld i not made to hold fast exp mob hate thay are for hold 1 mob for log base of time to make it eazyer for ppl to dd and cast magic on it give a pld min on a mob and there no way you will pull hate I gotta rate this ***up. *** hilarious.
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By Asura.Rinkydink 2010-08-27 08:41:10
Phoenix.Avelle said: Asura.Rinkydink said: meh. tbh i wasnt reading 8 pages of thread. I put my opinion across as a person who is an acutal PLD that DD's and a PLD that can oh fu....... tank. (when i cba).
I seriously reject the theory that a PLD is pretty much redundant. I can give you a GOOD example in 99% of situatins where a PLD would be better.
PLD is one of 2 maybe 3 jobs that can take AOE hate and go.. "so what".. others are like "sleep sleep do something"
people level in abys only atm.. and prolly will til 99... u get aggro you get gimp brds or blms.. who;s the best person to tank them? oh yeh thats the sam who has a pdt set.
i COULD quote a lot of "pld is pointless" posts and prove otherwise but i wont.. im simply putting my point to the OP not the other 8 pages.. ty good night :)
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-08-27 08:43:34
Interested. What are these 90% events/fights in which PLD out performs a DD tank?
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By Asura.Rinkydink 2010-08-27 08:45:11
i ve already mentioned one event.. which atm is 90% of how people lvl!! lol
that aside.. sit in whitegate.. see how many non zerg events where people require a "tank"..
oh u cant your on ifrit.. its as quiet as the cutty sark
Phoenix.Avelle
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By Phoenix.Avelle 2010-08-27 08:50:26
Asura.Rinkydink said: i ve already mentioned one event.. which atm is 90% of how people lvl!! lol
that aside.. sit in whitegate.. see how many non zerg events where people require a "tank"..
oh u cant your on ifrit.. its as quiet as the cutty sark
So you believe a tank is required in Abyssea? Am I reading this right?
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By Asura.Rinkydink 2010-08-27 08:52:27
lol.. me personally.. no
lol ive tanks abys on drg/war... it can be done.. im just saying that PLD WONT be obsolete because of old skoolers!
somebody somewhere on a non zerg event will ALWAYS ask for a "tank" and by that 90% mean pld..
ok phoenix is possibly different i deal with lolAsura! >.>
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By Ifrit.Darkanaseur 2010-08-27 08:58:13
Asura.Rinkydink said: i ve already mentioned one event.. which atm is 90% of how people lvl!! lol
that aside.. sit in whitegate.. see how many non zerg events where people require a "tank"..
oh u cant your on ifrit.. its as quiet as the cutty sark
With around 14 people bouncing hate using either /NIN or Third Eye, you think PLD is needed for XP in Abyssea? XPing isn't 90% of the content. Majority of HNMs are better tanked by DDs, PLD can be viable for low man groups sure, but in that case it's almost always better to manaburn. Same applies to Dyna. Also no, people being old school and wanting a PLD is counter productive, this is an efficiency discussion.
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Not trolling or anything... But really, wouldn't it be better to put a DD in where a PLD normally is in nearly every situation these days?
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