Prime WS Information, Testing, Discussion

Looking forward to seeing your results! Current dagger video out there tells us pretty much nothing

Tried gun / sword last night you may want to hold out a little longer if you want to buy these.

The sword in general felt lackluster but attack situation wasn't the best and maybe its mind based I went full dex on it.

For the gun the numbers were hitting ~56k full buffed with aria of passion. On a ranger you could get way higher numbers maybe its balanced around hovershot. Also a ranger has better ws gear / trait and will flat out do more dmg per ws with it.

I wasn't holding TP for gun ws so maybe that will be needed to pull higher numbers. At 3k tp + sv aria I had a 72k (a boss) then followed up with a 60k

Thanks for sharing. Can you recall what your buffs were for A boss?

And debuffs/set info if possible :)

I was attack capped (frailty / fury dia 3 / 2 box steps) had soulvoice songs (aria of passion) boost str no etudes

Gear was rostam (b) + gleti knife Nyame head legs feet r25 ikenga body(r29) PDL ring from VR + epam ring ishvara + moonshade + fotia belt + agi ws dmg cape +jse neck + empy hands +3

Remember any numbers for sword?

[00:57:19] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[00:57:19] The Demisang Red Mage takes 33412 points of damage.
[00:57:25] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[00:57:25] The Demisang Red Mage takes 29884 points of damage.
[00:57:44] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[00:57:44] The Demisang Black Mage takes 36862 points of damage.
[00:58:14] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[00:58:14] The Demisang White Mage takes 39503 points of damage.
[00:59:58] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[00:59:58] Degei takes 52362 points of damage.
[01:00:14] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:00:14] Degei takes 29823 points of damage.
[01:00:21] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:00:21] Degei takes 23455 points of damage.
[01:00:30] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:00:30] Degei takes 26174 points of damage.
[01:03:53] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:03:53] The Cachaemic Bhoot takes 17512 points of damage.
[01:04:01] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:04:01] The Cachaemic Bhoot takes 27286 points of damage.
[01:04:06] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:04:06] The Cachaemic Bhoot takes 20504 points of damage.
[01:05:53] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:05:53] The Cachaemic Ghoul takes 26726 points of damage.
[01:06:04] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:06:04] The Cachaemic Ghoul takes 21020 points of damage.
[01:06:13] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:06:13] The Cachaemic Ghoul takes 25941 points of damage.
[01:07:57] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:07:57] Skomora takes 28719 points of damage.
[01:08:05] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:08:05] Skomora takes 39113 points of damage.
[01:11:39] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:11:39] The Biune Umbril takes 18997 points of damage.
[01:11:46] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:11:46] The Biune Umbril takes 19441 points of damage.
[01:12:17] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:12:17] The Biune Umbril takes 15344 points of damage.
[01:12:53] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:12:53] The Biune Umbril takes 25645 points of damage.
[01:13:00] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:13:00] The Biune Umbril takes 17692 points of damage.
[01:13:45] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:13:45] The Biune Porxie takes 60692 points of damage.
[01:16:44] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:16:44] Leshonn takes 48007 points of damage.
[01:16:52] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:16:52] Leshonn takes 44558 points of damage.
[01:16:57] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:16:57] Leshonn takes 45901 points of damage.
[01:17:07] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:17:07] Leshonn takes 46926 points of damage.
[01:20:52] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:20:52] The Abject Acuex takes 30657 points of damage.
[01:20:57] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:20:57] The Abject Acuex takes 29826 points of damage.
[01:47:05] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:47:05] Gartell takes 40616 points of damage.
[01:47:15] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:47:15] Gartell takes 36731 points of damage.
[01:47:24] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:47:24] Gartell takes 31547 points of damage.
[01:47:32] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:47:32] Gartell takes 30207 points of damage.
[01:47:39] Ahlen uses Imperator.
[01:47:39] Gartell takes 27586 points of damage.

I was attack starved till ~leshonn and gartell I should have been close to attack cap (on gartell) unless the one chokehold I got hit by removed something like chaos roll (log doesnt show what he absorbs from you)

On gartell we had dia 3 + light shot + armor break + 5x box step SV honor march 3 minuet 1 madrigal

I was gearing imperator for dex it might be mind focused so maybe next run ill do gain mnd / use mind cape

[23:13:07] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:07] Aita takes 39816 points of damage.
[23:13:12] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:12] Aita takes 39120 points of damage.
[23:13:18] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:18] Aita takes 36630 points of damage.
[23:13:23] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:23] Aita takes 30943 points of damage.
[23:13:29] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:29] Aita takes 32798 points of damage.
[23:13:35] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:35] Aita takes 32500 points of damage.
[23:13:40] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:13:40] Aita takes 42552 points of damage.
[23:15:07] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:15:07] The Haughty Ranger takes 21795 points of damage.
[23:15:12] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:15:12] The Haughty Ranger takes 18030 points of damage.
[23:15:22] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:15:22] The Haughty Ranger takes 35064 points of damage.
[23:15:30] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:15:30] The Haughty Ranger takes 31902 points of damage.
[23:15:38] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:15:38] The Haughty Samurai takes 47728 points of damage.
[23:22:19] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:22:19] The Demisang White Mage takes 30364 points of damage.
[23:22:33] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:22:33] The Demisang Warrior takes 16160 points of damage.
[23:26:55] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:26:55] The Demisang Thief takes 21060 points of damage.
[23:29:52] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:29:52] Degei takes 32515 points of damage.
[23:30:01] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:30:01] Degei takes 33536 points of damage.
[23:30:07] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:30:07] Degei takes 44401 points of damage.
[23:30:14] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:30:14] Degei takes 45784 points of damage.
[23:38:20] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:38:20] Skomora takes 48081 points of damage.
[23:38:26] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:38:26] Skomora takes 63822 points of damage.
[23:38:34] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:38:34] Skomora takes 49710 points of damage.
[23:38:37] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:38:37] Skomora takes 50425 points of damage.
[23:43:18] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:43:18] The Gyvewrapped Naraka takes 9508 points of damage.
[23:43:25] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:43:25] The Gyvewrapped Naraka takes 12192 points of damage.
[23:43:47] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:43:47] The Gyvewrapped Naraka takes 12424 points of damage.
[23:43:54] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:43:54] The Gyvewrapped Naraka takes 12211 points of damage.
[23:44:04] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:44:04] The Gyvewrapped Naraka takes 14556 points of damage.
[23:48:50] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:48:50] Triboulex takes 14374 points of damage.
[23:49:00] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:49:00] Triboulex takes 54036 points of damage.
[23:49:06] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:49:06] Triboulex takes 57689 points of damage.
[23:49:13] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:49:13] Triboulex takes 30624 points of damage.
[23:49:21] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:49:21] Triboulex takes 36019 points of damage.
[23:49:25] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:49:25] Triboulex takes 29703 points of damage.
[23:55:45] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:55:45] Ghatjot takes 72620 points of damage.
[23:55:52] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:55:52] Ghatjot takes 61073 points of damage.
[23:58:24] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[23:58:24] The Abject Obdella takes 30657 points of damage.
[00:02:53] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[00:02:53] Dhartok takes 56774 points of damage.
[00:03:00] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[00:03:00] Dhartok takes 44960 points of damage.
[00:03:06] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[00:03:06] Dhartok takes 38756 points of damage.
[00:03:12] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[00:03:12] Dhartok takes 44838 points of damage.
[00:03:18] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[00:03:18] Dhartok takes 50007 points of damage.
[00:03:25] Kiratal uses Terminus.
[00:03:25] Dhartok takes 55305 points of damage.

For aita I had a potent frost on me nearly the whole time so it seems to have some agi scaling for sure because I had max buffs / debuffs for him (for terminus)
Another note for those WS assume every boss I had tp bonus 700 from warcry 190 from body 200 from ear and didnt hold TP (except ghatjot where I did a 3k)
I was likely attack capped on all bosses.
Only Aita /trib / ghatjot /dhartok I had soulvoice aria.

A lot of the trash mobs I wasn't attack cap and didn't use warcry.

Anyone close to bow? gun seems to perform as expected? does gun ws follow the same "low hate" pattern of coronach? just asking for clarity. thanks.

didn't do any enmity testing

I think exactly the opposite and I'm 99% sure stats on weapon are stats for WS and 40% of each is very likely. It almost wouldn't have sense if thats not the case.

Also I'm not sure why you are talking about mnk ftp replication when you have dagger WSs that does that already. Evisceration, exentrator, dancing edge and Pyrrhic replicate fTP on all hits. Pyrrhic has 1.75 fTP, but you would usually use it with at least fotia belt, so 1.85 with ~50% boost to damage at R15 it's like 2.75fTP ftp transfer WS at 1000tp and it's 4 hits like Merciless Strike.

With those stats Pyrrhic has a very high ceiling, but the problem is that ceiling based on massive PDL values using mostly Gleti's set, which will be even higher now with Aria of Passion. Prime dagger will have PDL aftermath on top of that. So even if 80k will be possible at 5+ pdif values, it will be very impractical. Another problem is scaling with tp. 1000TP bonus from Centovente will probably at least double fTP, so it's gonna be mendatory, but at the same time it will be a handicap for offhand hits on WS, so while bis it will be also frustrating (I wish dagger would get something like Ikenga axe)

I'm gonna try to get as much info from that Twitter video with dagger later. Its terrible source, but maybe I can at least do some general damage calculation.

Ok so Dagger Twitter video analysis

His cRatio is most likely ~0.4

Unfortunately with this cRatio spread of final pdif is so wide that it's impossible to tell if WS has fTP transfer.

He is not using dual wield
Merciless Strikes
#1 5198 damage 1231TP 8hits
#2 6413 damage 1285TP 3hits
#3 5758 damage 1045TP 7hits
#4 7616 damage 1567TP 6hits

If you look at 3hits one (#2) doing more damage than 8hits one (#1) at the same TP threshold almost, you could think it doesn't have fTP transfer, but at this cRatio it's still possible to get final pdif so low on the spread that 8hits with fTP transfer would be same or lower damage than 3hits at the upper spread.

If we take avg of first 3 WSs, we get 5789 damage at 1187TP
Now lets take attack capped value pDIF for dagger with some realistic achievable PDL on top of that, so lets say 30%. We get 4.355 pdif

1. If we then multiply our damage by 4.355/0.4, then we get ~63000 damage.

2. If we assume its fTP transfer and that 3hits was super lucky highest value at the pdif spread, then 3hits would be 31000 at 4.355 pdif, so almost 90k with 8hits at ~1200TP. Kinda too optimistic imo XD

3. If we assume its not fTP transfer and take avg again, but assume all of them were at upper value of spread, then we get 28000 at 4.355 pdif at 1200TP without any WSD (Im pretty sure he was using his TP gear considering his TP return). So using some realistic amount of WSD it would be around 47000+ at 1200TP and 4.355 pdif

Keep in mind above 2. and 3. assume almost worst case scenario

Looks like either way if it's ftp transfer or not, it should be pretty strong, especially considering we only had values from 1045-1567TP and it scales.

While this doesn't look as busted as the melee WS, it still seems to perform substantially better than Last Stand, which would make it the best marksmanship physical WS for both COR and RNG.

The dmg to hate ratio from LS in fights were rng was present made it not worth to even bother.

If terminus hate is similar to coronach it wins hands tf down for both jobs in terms of physical.
the crotch kick is the gun has no magic dmg stat on it so its physical only, but if u can go in and let off 6 terminus and the mob never looks? weapon opens up a ton of solos too.

I had a MASSIVE agi down aita so those numbers are WAY lower then it would be otherwise. Oh just realized it only clipped the entire list.

Which job did you use for Imperator numbers and were you dual wielding tp bonus offhand?

This. And does 3x Imperator give a darkness skillchain? The English .dat (and BG wiki) seem to suggest that it is impaction/compression/distortion, which makes no sense, but JP sites appear to suggest that the first skillchain property should be detonation, just like some other Prime WS.

Its for sure Detonation. Someone mentioned impaction is written lowercase in files and it's some bug

If it is indeed detonation and pairs well with Thibron, then the sword might be worth making.

For RDM with access to good frazzle and distract gear, it might also be interesting to see how Ayame(UC) performs with Imperator > Ageha > Savage blade > Kasha > CDC. But I guess for anything relevant she will still miss a lot even with Distract III.

Also he was doing that on RDM. He mentioned Gain spell and that's self target RDM spell.

Any ranged dps strategy would want both cor and ranger to have an improved coronach. If it deals more damage than last stand and has fixed enmity then rangers want it just as much, and probably even moreso than corsairs. Don't forget that Coronach isn't the only fixed enmity ranged weaponskill either. Namas Arrow ALSO has a fixed enmity, and it's entirely possible Pinaka could open up a world of potential for bow ranger to make a comeback. If Sarv has fixed enmity like namas arrow then it too could revolutionize ranger as a class, provided it hits hard enough.

We need enmity testing! Someone break out the scholars and get those libras going.

All us rangers who grew up on E bow reading with tears in our eyes

tears indeed. *** eastern shadow. *** cassie.

When it comes to the Staff, not sure which would be best for BLM or SCH when currently high end we use Bunzi Rod / Ammurapi shield which is a good 90ish Magic Acc, 80 MAB and 28 INT/MND as well as +10% MBdmg.

Opashoro has 35 Magic Acc, 80 MAB (unknown amount on AM) and 35 INT/MND but we miss out on 10% MBdmg on its Final Form.

So is it worth going into all the effort for a slight upgrade over Bunzi/Ammurapi ?

Huh? Composure and Gain-DEX gives RDM one of the highest accuracy levels of any melee DPS.

Good thing they were talking about Ayame then