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May 8th, 2022 Livestream Thread
By SimonSes 2022-05-10 09:13:56
Looks like Sroda Ring isn't percentage based, but is instead a flat +10 attack per trust.
That was exactly my guess from previous test I did exactly month ago tho. So what exactly they fixed?
https://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/56616/aman-specific-items/2#3620732
By Nariont 2022-05-10 09:20:26
Most DD jobs are kinda close to each other anyway. Some excels in zergs more than other, but how you plan to adjust Warcry+MS Warrior? You will nerf SP and Warcry or nerf WAR to lower the peak with those abilities up? I can't really imagine one or the other tbh.
As you said it varies from person to person but would like to think that most people agree the DPS scale is fairly close outside of zergs, discounting ody farming since that just skews who has access to good ws variety rather than actual dps potential.
Only jobs that id say are considerably weaker on the DPS scale is possibly pets and definitely pure magic, and you can argue that's "balanced" due to the presumed safety(outside of bst) of not being in danger, with that gap increasing everytime we get further gear creep, mostly due to the dmg potential via WS dmg and how quickly they can be used.
Maybe empy +2/3+additional augment lines on ody gear band-aid some of these but the above 2 feel more like core issues, magic especially due to nuke walls, otherwise low nuke dmg and the like, specially in comparison to magic WS which just got a considerable boost via nyame B.
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Ramuh.Austar
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Posts: 10481
By Ramuh.Austar 2022-05-10 09:20:40
does /checkparam not work?
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2022-05-10 09:21:41
Bahamut.Justthetip said: »Bahamut.Justthetip said: »Correct me if I'm wrong but they didn't talk about job updates and changes in the stream which is what I really wanted. Felt like that should've been hit on even a little but it seems that's gone out the window? I thought it was gonna happen before emp gear but clearly that's not the case. Otherwise this went just like I thought it would tbh.
They have never hinted any job updates in near future. They hinted new progression system, which have already happened (Master Level). Are you talking just in this live stream? If not they 100% have talked about job changes hell they did some of them already.
No Im talking about the past and what Geriond wrote in details. It was series of individual job adjustments and then Master Level as all job adjustment/new progression system. They haven't hinted anything else past that.
actual balance adjustments.
I think the word balance has never poped up with connection to all job adjustment. AFAIK they mentioned RNG needed individual boost (Hover shot) before Master Levels, because Master Levels wouldn't help it enough on their own (in their eyes ofc).
Also tbh I'm pretty sure balancing jobs right now will be SUPER hard if not impossible. Everyone has different opinion of what jobs are OP, what they value as OP. For example curing on DNC. Some people value this high, some people don't care at all and only want DNC to be stronger pure DD. Same for a lot of BLU utility. In general utility is really hard to compare, while damage is much easier. Even in term of dps, some jobs excels in group, some excels in solo selfSC. Some people don't care about solo tho or low buff scenario.
Most DD jobs are kinda close to each other anyway. Some excels in zergs more than other, but how you plan to adjust Warcry+MS Warrior? You will nerf SP and Warcry or nerf WAR to lower the peak with those abilities up? I can't really imagine one or the other tbh.
I imagine you would want THF to get dps boost? How tho? Buff Rudra? Then you would have unbalanced Dagger WSs, when you could just forget other Dagger WSs even exist. Twashtar would also be only option. Adjust all daggers WSs? Maybe, but that would also affect DNC.
Jobs like PUP are easier to boost, because changes to automaton will only affect PUP.
Also doing changes before Empy+3 is probably a bad idea. At least I am expecting Empy+3 to have lots of JA augments or enhancements that might shake the balance a little.
Afaik they also plan to add new JSE accessories? That could also change a lot. Not every job adjustment needs to be done through adjustment to job itself. It can be done through gear too. Infamous Yagyu Darkblade katana is the prime example. I mean I made a whole post but deleted it I don't wanna get into rants about job adjustments over my phone its a different view if you don't play the jobs so.
By SimonSes 2022-05-10 09:25:21
Quote: We are aiming for a job update that'll make your primary job even more enjoyable, while also piquing your curiosity in other jobs as well.
That screams Master Levels.
Additional skill and main stat = Makes your primary job more enjoyable
unlocking higher sj lvl, which unlocks JA, spells and traits from it = piquing your curiosity in other jobs
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2022-05-10 09:27:23
Quote: We are aiming for a job update that'll make your primary job even more enjoyable, while also piquing your curiosity in other jobs as well.
That screams Master Levels.
Additional skill and main stat = Makes your primary job more enjoyable
unlocking higher sj lvl, which unlocks JA, spells and traits from it = piquing your curiosity in other jobs Unlock sj Levels isn't job adjustments though. On top of that unlock job adjustments why we make subjobs locked for odyssey...
By SimonSes 2022-05-10 09:29:01
Bahamut.Justthetip said: »I mean I made a whole post but deleted it I don't wanna get into rants about job adjustments over my phone its a different view if you don't play the jobs so.
I play all jobs beside RUN, PLD and SCH (I know those jobs quite well tho), so I'm very interested about potential ideas for a balance and what you feel needs balancing :)
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By Asura.Geriond 2022-05-10 09:30:41
does /checkparam not work? Nope. It seems to be calculated on hit, much like Conspirator.
It's very likely to be simpler and more efficient to program it this way, instead of either constantly pinging the server with the number of trusts active or building a case library of everything that can add or remove a trust from party and keeping track of it that way.
By SimonSes 2022-05-10 09:31:42
Bahamut.Justthetip said: »Unlock sj Levels isn't job adjustments though. On top of that unlock job adjustments why we make subjobs locked for odyssey...
You need to consider this is translation. Keeping too much attention to specific words instead of whole context will usually lead you to misunderstanding their intention. Even in this video it was translated to job adjustment once, then to job update and in some other place job progression.
Ramuh.Austar
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Posts: 10481
By Ramuh.Austar 2022-05-10 09:35:40
does /checkparam not work? Nope. It seems to be calculated on hit, much like Conspirator.
It's very likely to be simpler and more efficient to program it this way, instead of either constantly pinging the server with the number of trusts active. it checks every tick anyways
By Veydal1 2022-05-10 09:37:20
Thank you for finding and posting this. I can still see how some might point to this clip (Question #1) as referring to master levels still. It's a bit broad and can be interpreted either way. Would love if someone that spoke the language could give their insight. Curious if there's anything lost in translation that might shed some light on the topic. Personally, I don't get the impression this was referring to master levels. Just by going off the translation provided in the subtitles, I don't think it matches. They talk about balance and being careful, etc. Gives me hope :)
I remember in one of the recent update notes, where Matsui would give his little speech, he mentioned how they wish they had more time leading up to the 20th anniversary. I actually found it - https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59251-Announcing-the-March-Version-Update
Considering what we got for the 20th anniversary, I'm not entirely sure what the dev team would need more time for...I wouldn't be surprised if they were hoping to release the job updates for the 20th. But that's just wishful thinking. I still believe! I would be beyond happy if they continued the trend they started with Majesty and Hovershot.
By SimonSes 2022-05-10 09:43:28
Thank you for finding and posting this. I can still see how some might point to this clip (Question #1) as referring to master levels still. It's a bit broad and can be interpreted either way. Would love if someone that spoke the language could give their insight. Curious if there's anything lost in translation that might shed some light on the topic. Personally, I don't get the impression this was referring to master levels. Just by going off the translation provided in the subtitles, I don't think it matches. They talk about balance and being careful, etc. Gives me hope :)
I remember in one of the recent update notes, where Matsui would give his little speech, he mentioned how they wish they had more time leading up to the 20th anniversary. I actually found it - https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59251-Announcing-the-March-Version-Update
Considering what we got for the 20th anniversary, I'm not entirely sure what the dev team would need more time for...I wouldn't be surprised if they were hoping to release the job updates for the 20th. But that's just wishful thinking. I still believe! I would be beyond happy if they continued the trend they started with Majesty and Hovershot.
This video is from 2020.
This quote is from April 2021
Quote: First up are job adjustments. I previously mentioned that we had finished up with individual job adjustments and have now turned our eye toward new job progression elements, but there are a couple more adjustments we wanted to make before diving deep into the next set of systems.
Specifically, there are some adjustments coming to rangers and some paladin spells. Don’t fret, though—we’re still on schedule for our new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs.
Those adjustments were obviously Majesty, Reprisal and Hover Shot. There was no hint to any other job adjustment planned for individual jobs past that point (unless fixes).
By Probono 2022-05-10 09:52:17
Thank you for finding and posting this. I can still see how some might point to this clip (Question #1) as referring to master levels still. It's a bit broad and can be interpreted either way. Would love if someone that spoke the language could give their insight. Curious if there's anything lost in translation that might shed some light on the topic. Personally, I don't get the impression this was referring to master levels. Just by going off the translation provided in the subtitles, I don't think it matches. They talk about balance and being careful, etc. Gives me hope :)
I remember in one of the recent update notes, where Matsui would give his little speech, he mentioned how they wish they had more time leading up to the 20th anniversary. I actually found it - https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/59251-Announcing-the-March-Version-Update
Considering what we got for the 20th anniversary, I'm not entirely sure what the dev team would need more time for...I wouldn't be surprised if they were hoping to release the job updates for the 20th. But that's just wishful thinking. I still believe! I would be beyond happy if they continued the trend they started with Majesty and Hovershot.
This video is from 2020.
This quote is from April 2021
Quote: First up are job adjustments. I previously mentioned that we had finished up with individual job adjustments and have now turned our eye toward new job progression elements, but there are a couple more adjustments we wanted to make before diving deep into the next set of systems.
Specifically, there are some adjustments coming to rangers and some paladin spells. Don’t fret, though—we’re still on schedule for our new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs.
Those adjustments were obviously Majesty, Reprisal and Hover Shot. There was no hint to any other job adjustment planned for individual jobs past that point (unless fixes).
March 2021
@439 of video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cz5z4bDIBXE
PLD and RNG where a push that they wanted
"Rest assured, the aforementioned job adjustments for all 22 jobs are still on their way"
the 1st video i posted was from 2021, miss-typed 2020.
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Posts: 3184
By Asura.Geriond 2022-05-10 09:54:03
Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
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By Probono 2022-05-10 09:57:14
Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
based off the language they used for PLD and RNG, i would have to say it isnt.
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By SimonSes 2022-05-10 09:58:05
Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels.
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2022-05-10 10:03:21
Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels.
100% agree, but the "wording" is the problem- its been obvious for years that their English localization team is either barebones or completely inept. I completely understand this isn't converting Spanish to English, and at times it will be by necessity slightly altered...but by the same token is sure ain't Aramaic to English, either.
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2022-05-10 10:06:49
Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels. I mean they used 3 different wordings and 2 of them were followed up on progression system and job adjustments are not the same thing not only that this wasn't the first time they talked about job adjustments. Either way seems like master levels was that adjustment which is a really ***way of "adjustments" because nothing really changed just a new system to grind for base stats most jobs aren't even helped by the master system.
By SimonSes 2022-05-10 10:09:53
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels.
100% agree, but the "wording" is the problem- its been obvious for years that their English localization team is either barebones or completely inept. I completely understand this isn't converting Spanish to English, and at times it will be by necessity slightly altered...but by the same token is sure ain't Aramaic to English, either.
That is true, but we know about how poor translation is for years now. That makes me confused why people haven't learnt anything still.. They are talking about plans for all 22 (or all existing) jobs in the same month and instead of understanding the context, people still hold them by words. I'm done arguing about it tho, I have more important stuff to do XD
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Cerberus.Balloon
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Posts: 424
By Cerberus.Balloon 2022-05-10 10:10:34
The whole 20th Anniversary feels like another FFXI-R, and UI Updates.
Lots of early promises that weren't completed due to lack of ability and will.
I read the job adjustments as job adjustments. They dropped individual ones like PLD and RNG for them. That doesn't scream Master Levels. It screams pulling individual job changes together.
By Probono 2022-05-10 10:12:53
Master Levels "new Progression system, you can further enhance jobs"
not the same thing as "Job adjustments"
Nov 2021
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lRrAii4KCo8
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Posts: 1360
By Odin.Creaucent 2022-05-10 10:18:38
The whole 20th Anniversary feels like another FFXI-R, and UI Updates.
Lots of early promises that weren't completed due to lack of ability and will.
I read the job adjustments as job adjustments. They dropped individual ones like PLD and RNG for them. That doesn't scream Master Levels. It screams pulling individual job changes together.
FFXI-Remake was never a thing, you are confusing that with FFXI mobile that was going to be set in Vana'diel but it wasnt going to be FFXI. FFXI mobile was then scrapped as the company making it, it wasnt SE, did a terrible job and SE didnt like it.
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By Asura.Geriond 2022-05-10 10:19:08
A progression system adjusts jobs. We're conditioned to think job adjustments = balance adjustments, but that's not inherently part of the definition.
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Cerberus.Balloon
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By Cerberus.Balloon 2022-05-10 10:21:22
FFXI-Remake was never a thing, you are confusing that with FFXI mobile that was going to be set in Vana'diel but it wasnt going to be FFXI. FFXI mobile was then scrapped as the company making it, it wasnt SE, did a terrible job and SE didnt like it.
Yeah, I thought FFXI-R was the name for the mobile game. And yeah, the reason it flopped is out of Squares hands, but I think it's more that they love to announce things before they are certain they will be completed
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By Odin.Creaucent 2022-05-10 10:23:21
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels.
100% agree, but the "wording" is the problem- its been obvious for years that their English localization team is either barebones or completely inept. I completely understand this isn't converting Spanish to English, and at times it will be by necessity slightly altered...but by the same token is sure ain't Aramaic to English, either.
That is true, but we know about how poor translation is for years now. That makes me confused why people haven't learnt anything still.. They are talking about plans for all 22 (or all existing) jobs in the same month and instead of understanding the context, people still hold them by words. I'm done arguing about it tho, I have more important stuff to do XD
You should know by now that the FFXI population makes mountains out of mole hill.
By Probono 2022-05-10 10:34:19
A progression system adjusts jobs. We're conditioned to think job adjustments = balance adjustments, but that's not inherently part of the definition.
that would make sense if they didnt say job adjustments when talking about PLD and RNG. since they added and or changed job abilities and or gifts and so on. where as ML which is a new progression system didnt.
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2022-05-10 10:39:16
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels.
100% agree, but the "wording" is the problem- its been obvious for years that their English localization team is either barebones or completely inept. I completely understand this isn't converting Spanish to English, and at times it will be by necessity slightly altered...but by the same token is sure ain't Aramaic to English, either.
That is true, but we know about how poor translation is for years now. That makes me confused why people haven't learnt anything still.. They are talking about plans for all 22 (or all existing) jobs in the same month and instead of understanding the context, people still hold them by words. I'm done arguing about it tho, I have more important stuff to do XD
Oh no arguing lol, more just a "I feel ya" moment^^
first the lyrical response: well ofc this is the fanbase that a large segment convinced themselves we were getting Time Mage and a whole new continent!
now for the tempered one: I would wager that part of the confusion specific to "job adjustments" came from timing. They make that statement, and then within a week we see Hover Shot introduced.
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By Bahamut.Justthetip 2022-05-10 10:42:52
Leviathan.Celebrindal said: »Master Levels are a "job adjustment for all 22 jobs".
Exactly. You guys paying too much attention to how they wording it. They were wording it "job adjustments for all 22 jobs" in the May video and "new progression systems coming down the pipeline for all existing jobs" in Announcing the May Version Update 2 weeks before that.
It's the same thing and it's master levels.
100% agree, but the "wording" is the problem- its been obvious for years that their English localization team is either barebones or completely inept. I completely understand this isn't converting Spanish to English, and at times it will be by necessity slightly altered...but by the same token is sure ain't Aramaic to English, either.
That is true, but we know about how poor translation is for years now. That makes me confused why people haven't learnt anything still.. They are talking about plans for all 22 (or all existing) jobs in the same month and instead of understanding the context, people still hold them by words. I'm done arguing about it tho, I have more important stuff to do XD
You should know by now that the FFXI population makes mountains out of mole hill. Kinda like with gear that changes nothing in game? Honestly we can drop the talk about adjustments clearly alot of people had wrong idea of what that meant.
Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2022-05-10 10:44:42
but we know about how poor translation is for years now. That makes me confused why people haven't learnt anything still.. They are talking about plans for all 22 (or all existing) jobs in the same month and instead of understanding the context, people still hold them by words.
This is the exact justification SE uses to go back on what they "said" they will do. "You guys misinterpreted what we said".
Years ago, I believe SE mentioned they would start adding TH gear for something like BST. Players took it literally. They later came back and said "no, what we meant was, if we did at some point implement TH for BST pets, this is how we would do it. we have no plans for that at the moment".
You can call it shitty translation and to temper our understanding accordingly, but they'll just use that to backtrack their plans and kindly excuse themselves from delivering what they did indeed say.
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By Asura.Geriond 2022-05-10 10:54:09
We're not saying this to excuse SE for doing or not doing things, we're saying this so that people don't get their hopes up for things that SE says and then come crashing down.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVwb60nU1IA
Let's try to keep this in one thread and not 5 others, FFXIAH. You've been rather messy lately and it's disgusting. Please mass report shitposters so they get hidden for moderation and derails of idiots do not occur. It's the only way to keep this from being a shit thread like all of the others.
Pre-roll music has started, the YT live chat is full of garbage, and everything is schedule to kick off in under 10 minutes.
Relevant other threads:
- Terrible hopes and dreams and expectations thread
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