2021 Ninja Gearsets

The 8 is real? I dont think I've ever seen that in all the DM campaigns done.

Its real, tho I dont have access to that char anymore. Its very old augment.

Moonlight Necklace > Sanctity Necklace (if the sole purpose you were going for was max magic accuracy) for the enfeebling mid-cast set.

Edit: Metamorph +1 (augmented) and Dingir Ring in the Nuke Set as well. (for max damage)

Why is Sapience orb in the fast cast sets instead of impatiens?

from what i've noticed, ninjutsu spells don't play well with quick cast. if insta cast actually happens, the spell is usually nullified or made ineffective.
Farming empy weapons recently on nin, attempting to cast sneak so i don't pull the whole area usually takes me 2-4 tries cuz it just won't stick and dispels immediately if insta-casted.

Probably lua has build mechanic to cancel sneak and shadows when casting sneak or shadows and when insta casted, it cancels new ones.

does having the relic body as precast then a fast cast body work for both the uts casting and adding in a fast cast reduction?

Yes, precast in body, mid cast into FC, (if you're already hitting haste cap in your mid cast set)

Do the same with the neck.

But it will only work for recast reduction, not to force an even fast casting time.

The new Odyssey katana should pratically retire ternion +1 offhand, right?

Also.... the new Odyssey set should probably switch a few ot the tp sets...

FTFY

Katana replaces Gokotai for Hybrid WSs and WS+MB setups.

Just got this bad boy today.

So what are we thinking on this new odyssey gear

If you aren't rocking JSE neck/Orpheus atm, what are some other good options for Teki/Cho/Chi? Baetyl/Eschan Stone, Fotia combo, something else?

Newly added Nyame gear seems pretty bonkers for NIN. Someone can double-check my numbers in case I've entered anything wrong, but looking at SimonSes' spreadsheet, I'm getting WSD path Nyame Body and Legs beating max DM WSD/MAB Herc for Hybrid WS.

Hands are Feet are both about halfway in-between DM and non-DM. So both not BiS but in practice an upgrade for 99% of people.

The only piece that isn't an improvement is head, which still loses to AF2+3, though interestingly the difference is only large when you're lacking MAB. Going from no MAB buffs to +90 (Idris Bubble + Wizard's Roll, or just Bolster Bubble) on a 0 MDB target, the difference shrinks from ~2k avg. damage difference to ~500.

I haven't looked at the numbers, but I'm guessing Body/Hands/Feet are probably also BiS Ten now?

I was looking at numbers that assumed attack cap, but it's also worth noting Nyame is +55 attack per piece, compared to Herc's +0~15, which could also matter a good bit in practice - that's, what, nearly 200 extra attack?

This is all not including those pieces also having Malignance levels of Eva/MEva/DT, so you get more safety on those WSD set swaps, which should really matter a lot for NIN. It may well be worth it to just always WS in 5/5.

STP path doesn't seem any better than Malignance for TP.

MAB path looks like some pieces could be BiS for ninjutsu MBs now? Compared to Herc, lower MBDI+ (but still enough to hit the cap with traits/earrings), a couple extra points of MBDII+, a lot more MAB/MACC and some extra +MDMG. Though if you can only pick one (I think they're R/EX?), the WSD set is definitely the way to go.

This didn't age well :)

I am surprised to see Agony Jerkin +1 in so many of the WS sets, especially in Shun over Adhemar Body +1.

R15 is the one and only reason Agony Jerkin +1 is in the sets.

R15 Augments (Lustreless Scales):
[1] Attack +60
[2] "Store TP" +10
[3] STR/DEX/VIT/AGI/INT/MND/CHR +10

The little extra attack and stats would make a difference, and the STP 10 would just help you WS again sooner.

No, Lunafreya's point stands strong and I'm sure she knew about the R15 augs of course.

Attack is important for Shun, but at the same time given Shun's TP mod, it's a WS where you cap attack faster than you do on other WS, given the same target and the same uncapped scenario.


There are other debateable options in the Shun uncapped set, but I digress, let's focus on the body slot.
I tested it on Langly's spreadsheet and indeed, as expected, Adhemar +1 B wins by far over Agony Jerkin R15.
Even a super cheap option like Rawhide A wins over Agony R15.

Not sure how your getting that. Now it's admittedly been about 6 months since I've done work on spreadsheets so maybe I missed something but I just downloaded the Shun Trust setup (uncapped attack) that I did back then and just as I saw back then, Agony Jerkin +1 beats Adhemar +1 by 9DPS. Feel free to check and tell me what I did wrong. And rawhide isn't even close.... Perhaps you just downloaded the spreadsheet and changed the one single gear piece, it's how they all work together that ends up making the differences. Please do let me know if you think there is changes to be made there that achieve a higher DPS in this situation.

https://github.com/NextGames2000/Spreadsheets

Note to others, I'll be working on the spreadsheets again in the coming weeks to add all this new odyssey gear so we can see the exact gains we are to expect as we increase the augment levels and at what point it beats herc gear for instance.

OT: there's a small error in your spreadsheet, missing STP+8 from Rao+1 B legs.


In your setup you were acc uncapped, I artificially capped accuracy.
Correct me if I'm wrong but I think the difference in our calculations was caused by an attack threshold.
If you're below this threshold the additional att on agony R15, then further boosted by Shun's att multipler, will produce better results.
If you're above this threshold instead, while still far below the att cap, Adhemar HQ B and situationally even the cheap Rawhide B, will perform better.


It doesn't really take much. For instance 150 TP (WS at 1150) is enough for Adhemar to win (Rawhide requires a bit more)
Or it could be Red Curry Bun food, or Berserk active.
I'm saying this to imply that this threshold is incredibly close to your testing scenario, and doesn't really require who-knows-what additional buffs.

Will fix Rao+1 thanks!

OK I think I see your point. In my spreadsheet example yes it does win out but when you factor in the common TP overflow that you would see (1050-1250) you are going to often already pass that attack threshold and therefore Adehmar will pull ahead (and at times even rawhide), making the instance this spreadsheet is made for increasing rare. Am I understanding that right? I will have to keep this in mind when I do recalcs this week and maybe mess with that TP setting a bit to fish these things out.

Appreciate you explaining.

~150 (a bit less actually) is what was required for Adhemar to be better than Agony.
Rawhide, as I mentioned, requires more.
This value is even lower if you use Red Curry Bun.
This value probably falls to zero if you have Berserk Active.

The amount/combination needed is so small that I wouldn't really consider Agony+1 R15 better in realistic situations.
Except when you have an att down debuff maybe?

If someone wants to simplify his sets and have like just a couple (capped/uncapped) I'd suggest Adhemar HQ B, otherwise Adhemar NQ B / Rawhide A if you're cheap.
Rawhide for instance, while never BiS, is "good" for a lot of stuff and acts as a very nice inventory saver for people with a ton of jobs and strained for inv space. Adhemar NQ is also cheap, but Rawhide is even cheaper, doesn't require you to farm the Abj (which can be annoying to solo) and has a wider selection of jobs who can equip it.
It's not about optimization of course, more about "convenience" I'd say.

which sheet you are talking about? There is ShunTrust and ShunTrustBuffed there. Also sheet already take TP overflow into account.

Makes sense. Now let me ask this. Obviously these spreadsheets are setup for Apex bats as that's the easiest thing to compare to. So fighting anything weaker and its going to be Adhemar hands down before even taking into account TP, but likewise anything stronger such as boss content... that's where Agony Jerkin will hang around as the best for quite a bit longer and maybe even all the way to 2250TP... right? Ie. Omen bosses, Gaol NM's etc.

Trust, trust buffed is one where I added some extra buffs such as berserk to see what it's like in those situations.

I don't know, in theory I would say "yes" but we would need to check the stats of those bosses. If they are very evasive you're gonna have to use all sort of acc buffs/food, meaning you'll be even more att starved.
If they have low eva, instead, you can get some more att here and there.

Your logic makes sense to me but realistically we would need the stats of those bosses.
Don't underestimate the Ra'kaznar Apex Bats though, as easy as they can be to kill, I seem to recall they have ~1500 defense, which is probably more than what some end game NMs have xD

Spreadsheets have been updated with New Odyssey gear. So far two passes so still may be an error or two or some DPS to be gained. Please call out any errors you find.

https://github.com/NextGames2000/Spreadsheets

My current gearswaps updated as well. Again second pass so call out any errors you see while I test.

https://github.com/NextGames2000/GearSwap

How do the Ternion dagger and the Kunimitsu compare for offhand?