Best Aeolean Edge Dagger

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Best Aeolean Edge dagger
 Fenrir.Melphina
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By Fenrir.Melphina 2020-07-27 14:01:53
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Quote:
Whats more potent on magical weapon skill mab or magic dmg?


Magic attack, hands down.
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By Nariont 2020-07-27 14:03:20
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ItemSet 360809

can basically apply the armor portion of this to every "mage" though think only rdm would be using AE?

Phoenix.Capuchin said: »
I’d assume that with the new wave of Unity augments, Ghastly Tathlum +1 has overtaken Seething Bomblet +1 for ammo slot. Anyone disagree?

Thought pemphedro was still the top option for AE
 Asura.Jdove
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By Asura.Jdove 2020-07-27 14:05:13
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I use AE on smn sometimes.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2020-07-27 14:05:20
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On a 1-to-1 basis, absolutely. But if this was in response to the ammo choice, Ghastly has a lot going for it with INT as a mod for AE and 21 M.dmg, versus Sething’s MAB+7.

Jdove, you might also be interested in Simon’s comments earlier on page 1 re: M.dmg.

Edit: oh, interesting note on Pemphredo too. Now I’m totally unsure, but eyeballing things that’s an awful lot of M.dmg to pair with INT on Ghastly...
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 Leviathan.Celebrindal
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2020-07-27 14:17:52
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pemphredo is what I use on both thf and rdm for it just because I already had it for nuking- no inventory hit.

I really think for a RDM, option for relic+3 boots over amalric+1 may be the more consistent choice. A huge macc gain, and you sacrifice 7 mab for 9 INT(path A or D)....so yes there is a damage loss but not huge. Not saying you'll run into big macc issues with Aeolian Edge on RDM, but if you're cleaving say Omen floors with Aeolian, getting 1 or 2 partial resists when hitting 14 mobs is far from unreasonable. A little extra macc never hurt, especially when the damage difference is so small.
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 Fenrir.Melphina
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By Fenrir.Melphina 2020-07-27 14:28:05
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I agree with the consensus that R 15 Ghastly tathlum +1 is better than Seething +1 now. I'll update my gearset to reflect it. As was mentioned, seething has a lot of base damage and I'm pretty sure it's enough to compensate the 7 MaB worth of difference.

Also I'm glad to see the red mage community chiming in here with rdm options. Yes, the amalric set +1 is what I had seen along with the Jhakri hands and cath palug crown. The difference in magic attack is significant. Herculean caps at 35 MaB, whereas mages have a lot more magic relevant stats on their primary gear slots. The difference between the mage options versus herculean is (eyeballing the difference here) approximately 100 ish* magic attack, which is enough to put a top red mage's damage well above what thief is capable of.

Edit: Also red mages have the magic attack bonus III job trait, which is 28 more magic attack on top of the gear differences.
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 Leviathan.Celebrindal
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By Leviathan.Celebrindal 2020-07-27 14:43:38
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Aeolian is a killer tool for pretty much any job that can use it, and should be built adequately. Its a magical WS- it can't miss! Its AoE, but no DoT associated with it, meaning things can be reslept if crowd control is an issue. (If you wanna experience real fun, coordinate a RUN+Aeolian Edge user, the second that the AE goes off, fire a Shockwave and nothing moves). And with the addition of Tauret, MANY jobs can have a very capable dagger for free- a lot of those jobs that don't think to use Aeolian.
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 Asura.Jdove
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By Asura.Jdove 2020-07-27 14:47:33
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That's why I asked what about mages, I already know what gear is good for it but I felt it was the politest way to point it out with out getting flamed by people who disagree.
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By SimonSes 2020-07-27 16:01:26
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Fenrir.Melphina said: »
I agree with the consensus that R 15 Ghastly tathlum +1 is better than Seething +1 now. I'll update my gearset to reflect it. As was mentioned, seething has a lot of base damage and I'm pretty sure it's enough to compensate the 7 MaB worth of difference.

Ehhh it varies. Using your set.

At 2250 tp with centovente offhand ghastly is 1,9 to 2.15% increase depends on int from unity.

Bomblet is ~1.7%

But at 3000tp ghastly is only 1.68% with max 11 int from unity.

This will change further. Bomblet will lose more steam if you add mab buffs or mab offhand. Ghastly will slightly decrease in power when you add more WSC and/or ilvl dagger with mdmg and if your unity is last.

Overall I would use the one you already have in inventory. If you have both, ghastly is safer bet, but you can make gearswap rule to equip bomblet at 3000tp maybe if you dont have that much mab from herc augments.
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By Gasho 2020-09-09 10:58:21
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got 2 herculean trousers

1- ( AGI+9 macc+10 mab +10 8wsd)

2- ( macc+20 mab+49)

which one is better for Aeo edge
 Asura.Aburaage
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By Asura.Aburaage 2020-09-09 11:09:15
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2nd one
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By geigei 2020-09-09 11:22:10
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first one
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By Crossbones 2020-09-09 12:46:59
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I like the second one more. Should do better on mobs with high mdb (so dyna wave 3). First one might be better on trash though. Personally if I have to pick between high mab or high wsd I go with mab almost every time because imo it's a safer pick for future content. They are both really good though.
 Siren.Kyte
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By Siren.Kyte 2020-09-09 13:19:07
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The second one is better; no need to overthink it.
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By Lili 2020-09-09 14:13:08
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Second one. No way 8 wsd can make it up for 39 MAB less.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-09-09 14:23:17
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It very much depends on how much damage and the situation.

If your AE was doing 90k then clearly 8% more damage is far superior to some mab.

If your "soloing" AE does 6k then yeah, 8% of that is less than 40 MAB should offer.
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By SimonSes 2020-09-09 14:46:23
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Asura.Eiryl said: »
It very much depends on how much damage and the situation.

If your AE was doing 90k then clearly 8% more damage is far superior to some mab.

If your "soloing" AE does 6k then yeah, 8% of that is less than 40 MAB should offer.

This is not really how it works.

For 8%WSD to match 40mab, you would need to already have 400mab. It's the threshold where 40mab adds 8% more damage. Also thats assuming that 8%WSD would be only WSD you have. If you already have some WSD, it will have diminishing returns. For example if you have 20%WSD already than adding 8% more will increase damage by 6.6%. In that case that mab threshold goes up to 500MAB.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-09-09 14:51:27
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Just trying to make it as easy as possible throwing out all the other variables, since none were listed.

Asura.Eiryl said: »
situation
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By SimonSes 2020-09-09 15:11:38
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Asura.Eiryl said: »
Just trying to make it as easy as possible

Asura.Eiryl said: »
situation.

You are not making it easy tho, you are making it more confusing than it is. AE can do 90k damage and 40mab can still be WAY better than 8%WSD. It's a very simple math. Just do:

(100+newMAB)/(100+currentMAB) to check how much % increase you get from mab. Example for +40MAB item and 200 current MAB (100+240)/(100+200)=340/300=1.1333=13.33%

then

(1+1*newWSD)/(1+1*currentWSD) to check how much % increase you get from WSD. Example for +8% WSD item and 40% current WSD (1+1*48%)/(1+1*40%)=1.48/1.4=1.0571=5.71%

Then you check what give higher % increase. Really simple.

This one
Crossbones said: »
I like the second one more. Should do better on mobs with high mdb (so dyna wave 3).
also doesnt make sense. MAB will always add same % of damage.

If you have 300MAB (in gear) and target base 100 MDB, then additional 40 mab will
4.0/1 = 4
4.4/1 = 4.4
4.4/4 = 1.1
will increase damage by 10%

Now same 300MAB and same additional 40MAB, but mob has 400MDB total
4.0/4 = 1
4.4/4 = 1.1
1.1/1 = 1.1
Still 10% damage increase

MDB of target doesnt matter.
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 Asura.Eiryl
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By Asura.Eiryl 2020-09-09 15:30:12
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It's why I picked such an absurd amount. 90k would mean you'd have thousands of MAB (or brew/Qutrub etc)and 6k means you have zeroish, without writing a paragraph.

You can't answer "what's better" without knowing the
Asura.Eiryl said: »
situation
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By Crossbones 2020-09-09 15:40:49
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How does targets MDB not matter? It's part of the damage formula:

Damage Dealt = D × MTDR × Staff × Affinity × SDT × Resist × MB × MBB × Day & Weather × MAB/MDB × TMDA × Potency Multipliers

Part right there where it says your MAB gets divided by the targets MDB. If I'm wrong I'm wrong but seems like targets MDB matters by looking at that formula.
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By Shiva.Thorny 2020-09-09 15:53:32
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It doesn't matter because it's a divisor and there is no cap in play, so while it changes the damage it will change the damage by an equal proportion for any gear.
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 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2020-09-09 16:07:00
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Crossbones said: »
How does targets MDB not matter? It's part of the damage formula:

Damage Dealt = D × MTDR × Staff × Affinity × SDT × Resist × MB × MBB × Day & Weather × MAB/MDB × TMDA × Potency Multipliers

Part right there where it says your MAB gets divided by the targets MDB. If I'm wrong I'm wrong but seems like targets MDB matters by looking at that formula.
Because (100+new mab)/(100+old mab) is the same as ((100+new mab)/(100+mdb))/((100+old mab)/(100+mdb))
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By SimonSes 2020-09-09 16:13:53
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That
Asura.Eiryl said: »
situation
is only based on your own 2 statistics, so instead of talking about
Asura.Eiryl said: »
situation
you can simply write how he can calculate whats better knowing his mab and wsd. In other words I gave him the "tool", so he can use it to get the info he wants (and use it again in future when he will need it again, instead of asking again). What you gave him is some generic response to anything that varies, but in this case, there is not enough variables and math is not complex enough to just leave it at mysterious "it depends".
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By Crossbones 2020-09-09 16:18:51
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Alright I don't know what any of that means but I believe you.
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By Boshi 2020-09-09 16:23:10
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Leyline gloves are way better than meghanda
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 Asura.Tawhoya
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By Asura.Tawhoya 2020-09-09 17:10:43
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SimonSes said: »

This one
Crossbones said: »
I like the second one more. Should do better on mobs with high mdb (so dyna wave 3).
also doesnt make sense. MAB will always add same % of damage.

If you have 300MAB (in gear) and target base 100 MDB, then additional 40 mab will
4.0/1 = 4
4.4/1 = 4.4
4.4/4 = 1.1
will increase damage by 10%

Now same 300MAB and same additional 40MAB, but mob has 400MDB total
4.0/4 = 1
4.4/4 = 1.1
1.1/1 = 1.1
Still 10% damage increase

MDB of target doesnt matter.

I'm not a big math guy, so I'm a bit confused also. I don't understand how a mobs MDB doesn't affect the damage. Are you stating the comparison between gear only or the scaling of MAB vs mob MDB?
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2020-09-09 17:53:56
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Asura.Tawhoya said: »
SimonSes said: »

This one
Crossbones said: »
I like the second one more. Should do better on mobs with high mdb (so dyna wave 3).
also doesnt make sense. MAB will always add same % of damage.

If you have 300MAB (in gear) and target base 100 MDB, then additional 40 mab will
4.0/1 = 4
4.4/1 = 4.4
4.4/4 = 1.1
will increase damage by 10%

Now same 300MAB and same additional 40MAB, but mob has 400MDB total
4.0/4 = 1
4.4/4 = 1.1
1.1/1 = 1.1
Still 10% damage increase

MDB of target doesnt matter.

I'm not a big math guy, so I'm a bit confused also. I don't understand how a mobs MDB doesn't affect the damage. Are you stating the comparison between gear only or the scaling of MAB vs mob MDB?
It affects the damage, yes. But it doesn't affect the difference between new MAB and old MAB. When comparing the percentage change between the new and old MAB values, nothing else in the formula crossbones posted matters.
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 Siren.Kyte
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By Siren.Kyte 2020-09-09 18:04:46
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Crossbones said: »
How does targets MDB not matter? It's part of the damage formula:

Damage Dealt = D × MTDR × Staff × Affinity × SDT × Resist × MB × MBB × Day & Weather × MAB/MDB × TMDA × Potency Multipliers

Part right there where it says your MAB gets divided by the targets MDB. If I'm wrong I'm wrong but seems like targets MDB matters by looking at that formula.

Writing the equation this way just makes it more attractive, but you could re-interpret MDB as a multiplier (that's less than 1). So with that in mind, it's easy to see that it doesn't matter how much MDB a monster has: it'll have no effect on the relative importance of two other multipliers in the equation, whether that be MAB vs WSD or MAB vs Affinity.
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By Ramuh.Austar 2020-09-09 18:12:38
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Damage Dealt = D × MTDR × Staff × Affinity × SDT × Resist × MB × MBB × Day & Weather × MAB/MDB × TMDA × Potency Multipliers

If it helps make sense, put the /MDB at the end, its the same result (outside of any flooring concerns.)

Damage Dealt = D × MTDR × Staff × Affinity × SDT × Resist × MB × MBB × Day & Weather × MAB × TMDA × Potency Multipliers / MDB
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