String Theory: A Puppetmaster's Guide *NEW*

For me the real question would be - Should you even make gear swaps for automaton actions?

If you do pet only fight and use DA/DT- augments on Taeon, then switching to ws gear probably dont give you much and also is very risky if your automaton tank.

If you fight with your automaton, im 99% sure, that equiping pet ws gear and gimping your own is generally counterproductive and wont result in any overall boost to total damage.

I guess the only situation where you would benefit from it, would be when you are pet DPSing and someone else is tanking. Switching to WS then, should probably be done manually and by experimenting with it a little, you will learn when to do it with setup you use.
Other situation would be when you nuke with automaton, but then its pretty obvious when to swap :)

only time i swap for WS these days is on the TP bonus WS if the pets the primary source of dmg

I've been using my DA/DT augments on Taeon lately but I've been holding onto my old pet: store tp herculean. Is there any use for that set any more?

If you use a lua or xml windower or ashitacast. Yes. I have my Herculean Set as my " STP " set so to speak to gain TP as fast as possible, then I have it set so when my auto goes down to a certain percentage of HP it kicks into a Mid LvL DT Set with Haste Dt and double attack wich is using the Taeon Set, Then if its hp gets realy low below 50% it kicks in a Full DT set of Rao +1. Also with the Herculean you can aug a WS set of herculean mixed with taeon for BoneCrusher with Vitality and Double Attack if you get lucky.

When you use RNG/RNG head/body and Animator P II for a fully ranged setup where your maton aint meleeing.

If I wanted my auto to not ws because it's tanking Kei and sch is doing sc... would using inhibitor and holding 1k tp on myself accomplish that?

I drop pet acc. Wont ws what it cant hit

The maton will always try to close an opened SC if nobody else does it as long as you have Inhibitor or Speedloader equipped. Speedloaders will make the maton wait until the end of the skillchain window before WSing, though, but it'll still mess with MBs.

It can be difficult for matons and SCHs to work together if you don't include maton WSing in the strategy. Personally I've had the most success replacing the SCH altogether and making two matons spam skillchains with each other. Alternatively you can make the SCH open an SC for the maton to close with a WS, saving a stratagem in the process which is useful if you only have a single SCH, but it requires you to equip appropriate pet gear and attachments (or get Companion's Roll) so the maton always has TP after every MB window is done. Of course this works best when making skillchains the Valoredge frame can close, as the Harlequin and Sharpshot frames aren't as sturdy for tanking.

Note that in both cases you want to use only Inhibitors and no Speedloaders because the latter will just waste time and make you wait forever for each SC to be closed. When skillchaining with a SCH you will need to hold 900-1k+ TP on the master at all times so your maton doesn't WS freely.

Valoredge:

Fire > String Shredder = Scission
Blizzard > Cannibal Blade = Compression (I don't think this made Fragmentation because Compression had priority)
Aero > String Shredder = Scission (Inhibitor)
Aero > Cannibal Blade = Gravitation (I think Speedloader only?)
Stone > Cannibal Blade = Reverbation
Thunder > Chimera Ripper = Detonation
Water > Chimera Ripper = Induration
Luminohelix > String Shredder = Distortion
Noctohelix > Chimera Ripper = Detonation
Fire > Thunder > Fusion > Bone Crusher = Light (Speedloader only; if the SCH is too slow the maton will close too early instead)
Aero > Noctohelix > Gravitation > String Shredder = Darkness (Speedloader only)

Harlequin:

Fire > Knockout = Scission (Inhibitor)
Fire > Slapstick = Fusion (Speedloader only)
Blizzard > Slapstick = Fragmentation
Aero > Knockout = Scission
Stone > Knockout = Detonation
Thunder > Knockout = Detonation
Water > Slapstick = Impaction
Luminohelix > Knockout = Distortion
Noctohelix > Knockout = Detonation
Blizzard > Water > Fragmentation > Magic Mortar = Light (Speedloader only)

Sharpshot:

Fire > Armor Shatterer = Fusion
Blizzard > Armor Shatterer = Impaction
Aero > doesn't work iirc
Stone > Arcuballista = Liquefaction
Thunder > Arcuballista = Liquefaction
Water > Armor Shatterer = Impaction
Luminohelix > doesn't work either iirc
Noctohelix > Daze = Transfixion
Blizzard > Water > Fragmentation > Armor Shatterer = Light (Speedloader only)
Luminohelix > Stone > Distortion > Armor Piercer = Darkness (Speedloader only)

I might be misremembering some of these WS and element priorities from when I tested them, so they might make different SCs than listed.

For the life of me I cannot figure out what I am doing wrong on Cait Sith N.

VE/VE

Light/Fire/Water

Coiler II
TS3
Magniplug I/II
Attuner
Flameholder
Turbocharger I/II
OF I/II
ARK III
Steam Jacket

I originally had inhibitors but found that maton was sitting on 2k+ TP waiting for SC/MB windows to close, so I swapped in the coiler/t.spring.

5/5 Taeon with DT-4/Acc25/DA5
Ohtas
Ambu Cape with all the normal augs
Klouskap Sash
Handler Earrings (no enmerkar/domest. because *** drop rates in this stupid *** game)
Varar Rings

Verified that relic body is swapping in for extended OD duration.


Maton survives the entirety of OD, but Cait is still at ~15-25% HP. Managed to kill twice in about 10 attempts, but 1 only because my COR alt Wild Card'd my Overdrive. I have 1 kill with a single OD. This is with a barataria COR alt giving Crooked Beast/Companions. What gives?

Missing Su4/Su5 makes a pretty big difference.

And Inhibitors still improve DPS significantly even if the maton sits at 2k+ TP for a while after an SC. It'll still TP and WS much faster outside of that doing Bone Crusher > String Shredder with added Distortion damage if the enemy isn't resistant. Granted, with Companion's Roll you probably only need Inhibitor 2 for the same results and you can equip Turbo Charger 1 or a Tension Spring in its stead, but I recommend testing double Inhibitors just in case.

Also, Cait Sith depends on luck sometimes because of Mewing Lullaby resetting maton TP. Inhibitors help to counteract this.

If I recall correctly I used the following to do Cait Sith on D with COR buffs using Xiucoatl, Thurandaut Ring +1, Anwig Salade, Domes/Enmerkar and otherwise the same gear as you:

- VE/VE
- Light/Fire/Water (I think you can swap Water for Wind to cap Haste as long as someone dispels Cait's Enlight asap)

- Inhibitor 1+2
- Attuner
- Flame Holder
- Magniplug 1+2
- Coiler 2
- Turbo Charger 2
- Steam Jacket
- Auto-Repair Kit 4
- Optic Fiber 1+2

Minions of Shiva doing a few Omen runs. Multiple Puppetmasters participating.

Here's link! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SedfVpaDaWE

Also, if you're a Puppetmaster on Shiva and enjoy doing crazy stuff with your PUP, come join us!

Updated link due to technical difficulties

Which augments for Rao? I assume Herc is TA, STR, Acc/Att?

Rao legs +1 are path B, Ryuo hands +1 are path A.

Herc is Crit Damage+5%, STR, Acc/Atk. However, even 6000 Fern stones later I've yet to get a Herc augment that beats Ryuo feet +1 (path D) when not Attack-capped, as they basically add +77 Attack if you include the set bonus plus a very large amount of STR. So take that as you will.

Rao Legs +1 are also replaceable by Hizamaru Hizayoroi +2 if you don't want to spend extra gil. They're relatively close as far as damage goes and Hizamaru helps with the fairly mediocre Acc of the set.

Silly, dumb question. Is it still worth it to get Kenkonken? Recently started playing again after a long long absence, like 7 years. I started Kenkonken before I stopped playing as I absolutely loved Pup and still do. However, one of my LS members is saying how it's not worth it in comparison to other ones. I also have a 119 Ragnarok I got for my War/Drk back in 2012 as well. However, I tend to do a lot of stuff solo or with a blue/dancer friend of mine and this seem pretty ideal. I know the answer is yes, but wouldn't mind some reassurance before I finish up.

"not worth it" well... if you expect KKK to be that one weapon that rules supreme in every situation then yes, it's not worth it, because simply it's not that.

My two cents on KKK:
1) Looks *** awesome
2) It empowers Stringing Pummel turning it into, likely, the best WS to spam at 1000 TP for the master
3) In situations where the master is DDing together with the pet, it's probably the best weapon, once you activate AM3 that is.
4) The -overload can be nice in some very nichey (with debateable utility) setups. It's hardly a game changer even then though.


If it were me and someone asked me a suggestion on where to dump 150 millions of gil, I'd say go for Xiucoatl. That weapon is pretty good per sé and it turns the pet into a god of death & destruction during Overdrive, without you requiring to mess with AM3 or anything else.
Talking about Path C of course. Its focus is on the pet but even if you wanna melee Master+Pet together then Xiucoatl Path C is really NOT that bad, likely behind AM3 KKK though.

Xiucoatl Path C is clearly a path for the pet BUT it's not really the worst for master damage.
Behind several other options? Absolutely, but I'd dare to say it's still decent if you wanna engage at the same time as your pet.

For more details ask SimonSes who's currently working on a PUP spreadsheet!

So as a returning a player, what's the best things to aim for first? I see the relic upgrades really lack accuracy, and the af pieces don't seem to be as good till at least +2. I do have a level 85 verethragna I've been compteplating finishing off to cause I can use it on my monk, which I also played as well.

Gear wasn't so bad trying to find on thf, but pup defenitly seems harder to figure out. Mind you, like I said I tend to solo or duo alot as there doesn't seem to be a lot of late night players and groups going on on Quetz

I still need to do comprehensive parses for all of PUP's REMAs, but just from some random parsing and playing in general I'm pretty confident that KKK is (still) our strongest master weapon. Its TP speed is just insanely fast and the AM3 sort of makes up for the lack of STP and multiattack on Heyoka if we are meleeing alongside our Automatons.

Aside from that it also is, of course, invaluable for pet burn and manaburn as the Overload suppression is actually important these days due to Flame Holder and Ice Maker.

I wouldn't be surprised to see KKK come up on top as the master's best weapon for DPS, what about the AM3 management thing though?
Let's leave aside content where you can build 3k TP beforehands, because it's pretty clear what the outcome is gonna be there.

All other content. Saving up to 3k TP every 3 minutes (roughly) means losing 2 WS, more or less.
Given how far spread towards WS the Melee:WS damage ratio is, it's not something you can ignore.
Other jobs don't have this issue because of high TP overflow.
What about PUP?

Saving TP to put up AM3 up is a loss, compared to using another weapon (Xiucoatl Path B, maybe Godhands?), or not?
I don't have the answer to that, I'm just wondering.


I know Vere is probably not that good on PUP. No gear to exploit Vsmite, no JAs like Impetus.
Godhands on the other hand I dunno. PUP lacks good WS gear true, but stuff like Raging Fists and Howling Fist with GH and lots of Multiattack gear surely can't be that bad?
We probably won't know for sure until SimonSes completes his WIP PUP Spreadsheet :-P

You don't really need to wait for the PUP spreadsheet just to compare Godhands, Verethragna and KKK really. It's not that much work to plug in PUP gear into the MNK spreadsheet and disable all the MNK specific buffs to get an idea of DPS. KKK and SP are a bit of extra work, but it's doable.

And AM3 management is only really an issue in very short fights, but PUP's TP speed isn't that much worse than that of Tizona/Thibron BLU as we have relatively similar DA/TA/QA values in master-focused gear without having to compensate for offhand Accuracy (which kinda makes up for being behind in STP). Yet they're fine using that setup in pretty much all content. And once you've got your first AM3 then maintaining it is easy. Lastly, while PUP is no MNK, our white damage is still pretty solid, which makes us slightly less reliant on big WS numbers.

Side note: PUP can always start fights with a minimum of 400 TP because of Tactical Switch, even if the maton's TP is at 0. Additionally, if you don't necessarily need the maton to do max damage you can also equip it with double Heat Capacitors for an instant 2k+ TP on the maton at the start of the fight, which you can then steal for an instant AM3.

KKK, Godhands and Xiuacoatl Path B!
Vere is gonna lose, no need to test imho.


I'm honestly a bit skeptic about PUP getting "similar" levels of DA/TA/QA and STP as BLU honestly °-° but colour me surprised hey.


Every 3 minutes, yes!

Very likely, but it's worth testing anyway.


BLU is far ahead with regard to STP as I mentioned above. However, to reiterate, one has to keep in mind they often have to make concessions to get enough Accuracy for Thibron and they're not always in their full DD spec. Additionally, due to Samurai Roll their massive STP is somewhat affected by diminishing returns.

Pre-AM3 BLU in full DD spec:
ItemSet 371567
(with 10 STP on cape)

Pretending that Ginsen is Aurgelmir Orb +1, then including Store TP V and Triple Attack+5% traits we get a total of:

- 71 STP
- 7% DA
- 29% TA
- 5% QA

Pre-AM3 PUP:
ItemSet 353251
(10% DA on cape & Samnuha Tights are also very good, but this setup runs 25% Haste instead of 26% to slightly make up for KKK overcapping MA)

That makes for a total of:

- 38 STP
- 18% DA
- 31% TA
- 3% QA

All in all, PUP is relatively close in terms of TP speed--and once AM3 is up both jobs can just switch to a higher STP setup.


That's good enough for popped or instanced content to get a headstart on TP. In Dynamis you can easily keep AM3 going after the first one.

General question regarding WS set. How much of an increase is the moonbow belt over a fotia belt? I'm seeing the WS neck used, but a moonbow belt +1 used instead of the belt. Can't afford the 42 mil for a +1 version and wondering if the regular version is better or if it matters?

WSs with higher fTP like Howling Fist should typically benefit more from Moonbow Belt, whether it be NQ or HQ.

With Stringing Pummel I'm actually not entirely certain anymore when tinkering with the MNK spreadsheet. I think Fotia belt might actually be superior even to Moonbow+1 since the STR mod is low and you typically have AM3 for DA/TA anyway.

Edit: Weirdly enough, the MNK spreadsheet is showing that for Shijin the Ele Belt is almost equal to Moonbow belt+1, which seems really wrong as that's +20 DEX for a 100% DEX WS.

That's good to know, I'm just another week or two away from mythic, and trying to get some gear for PUP.

With Malignance Chapeau, I've pretty much retired my trusty Ryuo Somen +1 even for pre-AM3 Kenkonken.
- Basically the same accuracy/STP (both slightly in favor of Malignance).
- Ryuo does have more Atk (through STR, and set bonus if also using legs)
- FAR better defensive stats on Malignance (Meva+75/Eva+55/MDB+3/DT-6%); if you ask me, that's easily worth leaning toward Malignance
- If for some reason you're capped attack (I tend to assume I won't be on PUP on serious content), Malignance gets PDL too

Otherwise, yeah I like Aerix's set and mine is very similar. I go with Samnuha legs, which he also mentioned - but personally, I don't particularly care about intentionally slightly under-capping haste to account for Kenkonken MA.

As far as Mythic AM3 up sets, what's a master-only set look like these days? I'm guessing something like the below (and 5/5 Malignance is reasonable too if you care more about Meva/DT- than somewhat better DPS), but I haven't been doing much melee PUP lately since getting my Malignance stuff. Any suggested tweaks?
ItemSet 371591