Apocalypse I119 III Or Ryunohige?

I just came back to the game and trying to figure out which is better these days, Apocalypse or Ryunohige? I remember a friend telling me Drakesbane needed a buff wondering where that stands atm, and I read Apocalypse is back to it's former glory so wondering which is better? I don't have much time as I used to farm for money these days otherwise i'd go for both...because why not. For now I'm just curious on everyone's thoughts on these two weapons so I can start working on one for now. Any help would be appreciated :) Thanks in advance.

I have apoc III and would never trade it. Yes it is nice again, but we still miss like always lol

TL;DR - Apocalypse but learn how to get the most out of it.

Yes, and no. It can but it cannot maintain it all the time. Last Resort will eventually fall and will be down for a minute or so. During this period you'll need to use Hasso with Apocalypse AM to come close to the effect and that comes at the cost of hammering your recast timers. With regards to Dread Spikes this can be very dangerous.
True, but see above.
Catastrophe has an annoying habit of missing at the worst of times through the aptly named 'Fudo Syndrome'. Catastrophe is also hardly a Dark Knight's strongest weapon skill so you're directly harming your DPS by spamming it. I typically use it to get AM active and ride Dread Spikes from there.
Wrong. Dragoon gets Accuracy Bonus III which is +35 accuracy but it also gets SIGNIFICANTLY higher amounts of accuracy through it's job points and gifts compared to a Dark Knight.
Dark Knight Accuracy Gifts: +3 / +5 / +6 / +8 (+22 total)
Dragoon Accuracy Gifts: +9 / +14 / +18 / +23 (+64 total, +99 counting Accuracy Bonus III)
It is also worth noting that Apocalypse is one of the only Scythes to get any amount of accuracy on it whereas accuracy can be found everywhere on high level Polearms like Habile Mezrak and Lembing.
Wrong again, but I can't say I blame you. You'd be amazed how many people do not know that Dragoon was updated a while back and that it's Wyvern now gives it 10% Job Ability Haste as long as it's alive. This, coupled with Hasso, puts it at near cap. A Dragoon can also sub Dark Knight and use Last Resort to fully cap if they wish. Job Ability Haste is completely capped during Spirit Surge as well.
Why people say the Wyvern is fragile is beyond me. Steady Wing gives it a massive Stoneskin effect proportional to it's maximum HP. Spirit Link also restores a huge amount of HP to the Wyvern while transferring up to x5 Enhancing Magic effects and giving it a strong Regen effect. Spirit Link and Steady Wing have very generous reuse timers as well. Add to this Temporary Items you can use in Escha which directly heal the Wyvern and you really have to go out of your way to let your Wyvern die.
Wrong again. Dragoon does actually get a native Attack and Defense Bonus, a very strong one too, and it comes from the same source as it's Job Ability Haste - It's Wyvern. A Dragoon gets a 20% Attack and Defense Bonus while it's Wyvern is alive, which as I said above is very easy to do. You can also count Angon's -25% Defense Down effect as a +25% Attack Bonus as well, so in actuality a Dragoon can get a higher amount of Attack Bonus than a Dark Knight can. The Dragoon also gets a 10% Double Attack effect through the Wyvern when it has enough Job Points.
Dark Knight's biggest weakness, and it's a huge one, is that it is heavily reliant on establishing and maintaining a Max HP Boost through Drain III. A lot of targets are resistant to this tactic and as such a Dark Knight will begin to fall behind in DPS quite badly. Dark Knight is also reliant on that Max HP Boost because using Last Resort and Souleater without that safety net is absolute suicide and you will be dead before you know it.
Dragoon's only gimmick is that it needs to keep it's Wyvern alive to reach it's full power, that's not very hard. It actually needs fewer gimmicks to reach it's full power than a Dark Knight does. Restoring Breath heals itself and can also heal it's party members for a reasonable amount.
Polearm weapon skills are very nicely placed on the skillchain chart and the job itself is very skillchain friendly as it can gain TP rapidly through Spirit Link and it's Jump abilities. Stardiver gets stupidly powerful with Trishula and it becomes capable of closing an Umbra skillchain, something the job is capable of doing by itself in a solo 4-step. Scythe weapon skills on the other hand scale very nicely with high TP as the fTP modifier goes through the roof on things like Cross Reaper. That's how I play Dark Knight, I maximize melee-damage-over-time through Max HP Boost and Souleater while building TP for a powerful Darkness closer.

Apocalypse is a solid go-to for a returning player looking for a lot of power for relatively small effort required. Drakebane spamming is a serious no-go for any career Dragoon as that weapon skill is in serious need of a fix. Stardiver is by far a Dragoon's strongest weapon skill for general use and you'd actually be looking to get a Trishula in future to make the most out of it. I would go for Apocalypse in your position but be sure to read the Dark Knight forums to research how to get the most out of the weapon.

I have yet to finish my Apoc afterglow as I completed liberator first. I totally agree with Ruaumoko with regards to catas annoyance of missing when you need it most but know it will be a fun weapon once done.

In regards to pure DPS liberator is still king for DRK

While Trishula does make for more powerful Stadivers, a fully upgraded Ryunohige is still the highest DPS weapon for DRG. I was surprised at how good Trishula turned out to be, though. It's a solid second place, and well ahead of the following options. I kinda want one just for short fights/nomadic stuff(incursion, etc)

Trishula does have the advantage of simplicity though. Doesn't need to build AM3. I was going to mention fights that wipe AM3 when confrontation wears, but they fixed that for Unity wanted NMs at least. (still wipes wyvern level up though. ***.) Short fights do still suck for Ryu though.

Tizona.

One of my all time most common phrases, comes to mind, "Do what you want." It is your money every month not other people. I have seen an AG apoc run some psychotic dmg, no apoc AG drk should be taken lightly. However I can not speak about what a drg can do.


Maybe for scythes, (I don't have AG lib or apoc yet so don't know) but as for raw dps I am willing to bet rag beats lib.

One of the major concerns it the lack of acc needed for 145+ content, yes you might find a group that will let you run drk in some 135 content assuming you have the acc for it. The only way lib might beat rag in terms of dps is assuming you can ride souleater/drain 3 the full fight. (but what is to say a rag drk can't run a non-MB drain III and souleater)

I am currently making both apoc and rag 119 (III) and I am working through my assaults for lib, most likely I will waste the time to make both caladbolg and redemption as well as aeonic scythe whatever the hell the name is (gross those weapons suck why do you want those? Why? Because I fn want them that is why and until you pay my monthly fee and an hourly rate to play how you want me to, that is what I intend to do with MY time and money.) With enough acc you "should" be blasting an avg of 30k reso, of course varies depending on some 8k hits and some 50k+ hits.

I have personally pushed out 20k torcleaver avg, (with 32k spikes) with bad gear and a lolmacbain. (before I started upgrading gear from skirmish) The problem with scythe isn't the base dmg or even the acc if you gear right. The problem are the ws avail don't compete with great sword ws.

However, apoc is still a solid choice for drks if the OP wants to make apoc AG,

as for this guy here,
take that ***somewhere the *** else man, not everyone wants to bandwagon the same ***every other melee plays, and fyi a AG rag/lib/apoc drk will give a blu a run for their money if not have the upper hand on a most of fights. Furthermore gives a reason for people to jump on brd once in a while too, let some other jobs play for a change, The narrow minded ***is stale.

edit: I thought I was done with my comment but I decided to go full fn nerd with this blu crap.

People are putting blu into this superman syndrome phenomenon because blu so effortlessly caps -delay and puts out at the very least respectable numbers. Now while I don't deny blu's ability to deal dmg and self haste, or even self erase for that matter. Sometimes, just sometimes Green Lantern, Batman, or even Aquaman (we can call thf aquaman) all want to be in the comics once in a while.

Superman is this almighty warrior that barely puts effort into things, (don't try to tell me it is hard for blu to DD I have seen skrim geared blus that solo cp in escha zitah for weeks to hit that 1200 mark just to put out some crazy numbers on nm's) Now while a smart/good player will have more than just tp set and cdc set at any rate nm's just drop from that spamming.

Anyone that knows comics knows superman can win fights, but if you know more about comics you know there are other heroes that can win fights too. Not all of them have laser eyes and can kill everything they look at but there are more than one ways to win a fight. I have seen thf's beat blus, I have personally beat mythic blu on cor (A damn good blu in my opinion as well, definitely one of the best blus I have pt with, generally he or myself are top DD when I am on cor it is a constant battle) Rag AG war and drks can smoke a blu in dmg.
Again, I get that blu is great and all, but seriously man, let Wonder Woman, The Flash or Cyborg be on the cover once in a while. If they know their ***they will pull their weight anyway.

If the only set up you can think to win a fight involves the current flavor of the month, then I really feel bad for you since it seems you can't play anything you really enjoy.

Explain the hypocrisy in stating play what you want and then saying stop telling people only play one job.

There is none, it is saying don't let people make the choice for you in both aspects, if this was a year and a half ago people would be screaming koga or vajra.

Your lack of ability to see past your own judgement of people based off inability to see more than your own biased representation of a topic shows full force with your consistent trolling both in game and on the forums.

Do you occasionally give out good informative perspectives? Yes, but more than half the ***you say is just childish and annoying to get a rise out of someone you don't like or stir the pot for entertainment.

No troll, I said give other jobs a chance and stop telling people blu only. You are as always trying to stir ***up. Nothing in there did I tell people they can only play a different job than blu, I only said give other jobs a chance to play and stop telling people blu only.

Ok, "Mr. I can only read into what people say if I want to troll them and can't see other things people say."

What does it mean to you when a drg and drk question comes up and someone comes up with the same stale remarks about flavor of the month jobs they have done since the dawn of the game.

"Tizona"

Seems like a whole lot of skip other jobs and only blu right there. Just like when relic rng ran the bcnm's, just like when koga only dd, just like the rudra train. People would ask for an opinion about 2 things and some bandwagon tool would jump in and only mention the bandwagon job with nothing else on topic at hand.

Drop the trolling already, any time you are in a conversation the conversation is devalued and becomes nothing more than feed the troll. Not wasting time with you anymore. You have a God awful reputation both in and out of the game. You might want to consider changing that, when someone immediately has a bad impression of you before spending time with you. It is time for self evaluation.

Enough. Saying "Tizona" in a thread explicitly asking about two weapons for completely different jobs is not helpful, warranted, or even mildly amusing. All it does is stir up ***and reinforce ignorant notions about job viability.

Another amazing niche of Apoc -> Ballista :)
Something very satisfying about being able to plow through 3-4 other wars/mnks/drgs/sams.

There are many other reasons I love Apoc, but ballista destruction is just the most recent. The weapon has scaled very well and while its not the best dps option, it is still right up there in top 4.

ITT: Being fed up with people reinforcing dumb *** job viability misconceptions and telling them to knock it off, and providing a bit anecdotal info, is "going nuts".

I'm amused with the fact that Spicyryan wasn't the one mentioned "Tizona" and yet got bombarded with hate from Thorva.

No it was him attempting to troll me that got the bombardment.

just to chime in on the "Tizona" > all thing:
Resolution is a hell of a drug.

Banned because apoc/ryuno can't use resolution!

Looks to me that you are just a lil butt hurt that someone doesn't agree with what you are saying.

As for Lib vs Rag its the old Lightsaber vs Blaster Lib is for the more civilised, intelligent drk.