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Minimum Wage
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Serveur: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9534
By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 09:22:48
Family connections? Not having to pay much, if anything, for college out of pocket? Getting a great start in life in general?
No one is saying you haven't worked hard, what we're asking for you to understand is that sometimes it takes a lot more than hard work.
I'll say it. Nobody who spends as much time posting on this site just to argue with everyone who dares to post in at the height of tax season isn't a "hard working" tax guy. That's like a tire guy having loads of free time right after the first snow, either they're not trying to be busy or they really suck at their job. Sure, whatever you say man.
How's McDonald's treating you? You should be able to tell us all sorts of anecdotes about how you are a slave of the system and all that.
I've actually never worked in fast food, or any restaurant. If you have to believe that I'm a minimum wage employee to keep from imploding, feel free, because the reality of where I started and where I am would probably make you question living.
your blind hatred towards the successful.
You seem to have this assumption that I somehow lack personal success. A lot of conservative posters make that assumption, it seems. Like it's somehow assumed that if you want to see others doing better it means you yourself are not doing well.
That's the nature of people, it's much easier to accept your situation if you have someone worse off to belittle. Truth be told, I couldn't care less what someone else's situation is unless it directly effects me, and even then, only if they haven't made the bed for themselves.
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By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:27:11
This thread is amazing from min. wage to poor attempts at u mad bro.
By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:27:41
It's almost as if there is nothing worth discussing so e thug it up.
Serveur: Shiva
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-03-18 09:27:45
Can we just replace waiters with robots already?
At Evil Enterprises we're working to replace everyone with robots! From touch screen kiosks to automated phone support, we're working hard so eventually you won't have to.
We got tired of looking at your bad tattoo choices, "flock of seagulls" hair styles and those gaping holes in your ear lobes. Especially when all you do all day at work is complain about not getting paid enough. So learn to enjoy not having any money...money is the root of all evil anyways so we are actually doing you a favor taking it away from you.
You're Welcome
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By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:28:26
The quote trains to make the perfect trifecta of *** !
By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:29:42
Please carry on this discussion is quite fascinating I almost learned something.
By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:31:04
Can we just replace waiters with robots already?
At Evil Enterprises we're working to replace everyone with robots! From touch screen kiosks to automated phone support, we're working hard so eventually you won't have to.
We got tired of looking at your bad tattoo choices, "flock of seagulls" hair styles and those gaping holes in your ear lobes. Especially when all you do all day at work is complain about not getting paid enough. So learn to enjoy not having any money...money is the root of all evil anyways so we are actually doing you a favor taking it away from you.
You're Welcome
Flock of seagulls giant holes in ears...Starbucks or Whole Foods ?
Seraph.Ramyrez
Serveur: Seraph
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Posts: 1918
By Seraph.Ramyrez 2015-03-18 09:33:03
It's almost as if there is nothing worth discussing so e thug it up.
Well I tried to max a sex joke but you ignored it!
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Serveur: Asura
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Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-03-18 09:33:48
I've actually never worked in fast food, or any restaurant. If you have to believe that I'm a minimum wage employee to keep from imploding, feel free, because the reality of where I started and where I am would probably make you question living. I highly doubt that. You keep claiming to be a manager, but your lack of business knowledge either signifies that you are either lying or one of those "liberal arts managers" who will forever be in lower management for their entire professional career.
By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:34:29
On topic this is about Seattle I think. Well you couldn't pay me enough to live in that dingy rain filled ***hole.
It's like San Fran but with more hipster d bags.
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Serveur: Odin
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Posts: 9534
By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 09:36:17
I've actually never worked in fast food, or any restaurant. If you have to believe that I'm a minimum wage employee to keep from imploding, feel free, because the reality of where I started and where I am would probably make you question living. I highly doubt that. You keep claiming to be a manager, but your lack of business knowledge either signifies that you are either lying or one of those "liberal arts managers" who will forever be in lower management for their entire professional career.
If you've determined I have a lack of business knowledge, I'll consider that a shining endorsement. Seriously, though, I'm being voir dire'd about business by the guy who said the slaves should have just run away...
Serveur: Shiva
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Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-03-18 09:44:46
Flock of seagulls, giant holes in ears...Starbucks or Whole Foods ?
every fuggin where...
my only concern with whole foods is all the signs for "fair trade" it makes me feel cheated... unless fair trade is code for "take all their stuff and give them a garbage bag full of smallpox blankets"
/looks into it
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By fonewear 2015-03-18 09:48:12
Smallpox blanket can I get that at Target ?
Serveur: Shiva
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By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-03-18 09:48:13
If you've determined I have a lack of business knowledge, I'll consider that a shining endorsement.
You should take his endorsement to your boss and ask for a promotion...
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Serveur: Shiva
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Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-03-18 09:52:26
Smallpox blanket can I get that at Target ?
we get them second hand from hospitals that treat smallpox patients...
I think hospitals buy them from herders of some rare breed of super itchy wool rats...
I picture a greek island... turned into a landfill and a turk with a really really small little bo peep hook
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 10:10:45
If you've determined I have a lack of business knowledge, I'll consider that a shining endorsement.
You should take his endorsement to your boss and ask for a promotion...
I don't strictly have a boss, but I could just adopt a new title, I gave myself my current title, anyway.
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Ragnarok.Nausi
Serveur: Ragnarok
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By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-03-18 10:22:19
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 10:23:25
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
Let's take every change to the farthest extreme for hyperbolic effect, why not?
Raising the minimum is nearly meaningless, rage the median, then we'll see some change.
Serveur: Shiva
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Posts: 20130
By Shiva.Nikolce 2015-03-18 10:29:03
His Royal Majesty, Emperor Jassik said: »I gave myself my current title, anyway.
wow!... let me try....
Dumb old Nikolce, Evil Jerk said: »
dangit
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Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2015-03-18 10:34:42
Smallpox blanket can I get that at Target ? No. You get them from the BIA.
Lakshmi.Aelius
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By Lakshmi.Aelius 2015-03-18 10:41:33
Had a talk with my friends in RL about this and I had a somewhat of a plausible solution than just having a global minimum wage for every worker.
Why not have tiers of minimum wage based on age and experience? For instance, a 16 year old high school student gets their first job at McDonalds and earns $7.50 an hour at minimum wage. Meanwhile, someone who has worked at McDonalds before and is 30 years old would be able to earn $9.50 an hour at MW.
Before you answer with; "How fair is it that the 30 year old gets paid more for the same work as the 16 year old?"
I do have an answer for this.
Responsibility. How much responsibility does a 16 year old has compared to a 30 year old. Who is more likely going to work more hours? Who is going to be encouraged to come to work to make that payment on bills they most likely will have? Do they have children to support?
There is a simply difference that a 16 year old is only working for lunch money, to buy things that are luxury. The 30 year old is going to have to support themselves with rent, electric, a reliable vehicle and other necessary bills just to get through life. Sure, he may not have a diploma or GED but at least he isn't living on the streets and in a cardboard box.
Eh, my thoughts...
Ragnarok.Nausi
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Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-03-18 10:44:36
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
Let's take every change to the farthest extreme for hyperbolic effect, why not?
Raising the minimum is nearly meaningless, rage the median, then we'll see some change.
Tell me why 100/hr is bad.
Lakshmi.Flavin
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Posts: 18466
By Lakshmi.Flavin 2015-03-18 10:44:37
The biggest gripe I usually hear here is when they were talking about upping min wage to $10 the guys making $10.15 an hour were pissed because everyone was essentially getting a raise but them and people doing less work would be making right around the same money lol... They felt like it wiped out their time there and the raises they had previously received.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 10:49:51
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
Let's take every change to the farthest extreme for hyperbolic effect, why not?
Raising the minimum is nearly meaningless, rage the median, then we'll see some change.
Tell me why 100/hr is bad.
The same reason 50/hr is bad... it's grossly above the median wage and would raise the floor for about 95% of earners. The only reason a minimum wage increase doesn't have a major effect is because it is below the level of almost all earners, which is the same reason it generally has no causal effect on the economy.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 10:56:15
The biggest gripe I usually hear here is when they were talking about upping min wage to $10 the guys making $10.15 an hour were pissed because everyone was essentially getting a raise but them and people doing less work would be making right around the same money lol... They felt like it wiped out their time there and the raises they had previously received.
Well, there's 2 things I want to say about this point.
1. If a semi-skilled worker is making incrimentally more than a minimum wage worker, there is a problem.
2. Most minimum wage workers don't make minimum wage, they make ~5% more than minimum wage, and min wage increases rarely go much above what they were already making. So, it's essentially a ~1-2% raise for them. Which is pathetic, considering they're rarely entitled to cost of living raises every year, and the 3% they may get once in a while doesn't even offset inflation, much less rising healthcare costs or any manner of education/growth.
Unskilled wages are not what the market will bear, they're the product of a large number of unskilled people undercutting each other for crappy jobs. And the employers who depend on cheap labor aren't about to kick themselves to offer people wages that allow them vertical mobility, because it only lowers their pool of expendable people.
Ragnarok.Nausi
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Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-03-18 10:56:44
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
Let's take every change to the farthest extreme for hyperbolic effect, why not?
Raising the minimum is nearly meaningless, rage the median, then we'll see some change.
Tell me why 100/hr is bad.
The same reason 50/hr is bad... it's grossly above the median wage and would raise the floor for about 95% of earners. The only reason a minimum wage increase doesn't have a major effect is because it is below the level of almost all earners, which is the same reason it generally has no causal effect on the economy. Given the story that coined this thread, how can you possibly claim raising the min wage has no effect?
The effect is clear and very well documented.
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By Odin.Jassik 2015-03-18 10:59:07
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
Let's take every change to the farthest extreme for hyperbolic effect, why not?
Raising the minimum is nearly meaningless, rage the median, then we'll see some change.
Tell me why 100/hr is bad.
The same reason 50/hr is bad... it's grossly above the median wage and would raise the floor for about 95% of earners. The only reason a minimum wage increase doesn't have a major effect is because it is below the level of almost all earners, which is the same reason it generally has no causal effect on the economy. Given the story that coined this thread, how can you possibly claim raising the min wage has no effect?
The effect is clear and very well documented.
Read the article, bud...
Ragnarok.Nausi
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6709
By Ragnarok.Nausi 2015-03-18 11:02:49
Lets raise the minimum wage to 100/hr.
What would be the problem with that?
Let's take every change to the farthest extreme for hyperbolic effect, why not?
Raising the minimum is nearly meaningless, rage the median, then we'll see some change.
Tell me why 100/hr is bad.
The same reason 50/hr is bad... it's grossly above the median wage and would raise the floor for about 95% of earners. The only
reason a minimum wage increase doesn't have a major effect is because it is below the level of almost all earners, which is the same reason it generally has no causal effect on the economy. Given the story that coined this thread, how can you possibly claim raising the min wage has no effect?
The effect is clear and very well documented.
Read the article, bud...
Businesses are closing because the min wage is going up, it could not be any clearer.
Serveur: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2015-03-18 11:05:06
Had a talk with my friends in RL about this and I had a somewhat of a plausible solution than just having a global minimum wage for every worker.
Why not have tiers of minimum wage based on age and experience? For instance, a 16 year old high school student gets their first job at McDonalds and earns $7.50 an hour at minimum wage. Meanwhile, someone who has worked at McDonalds before and is 30 years old would be able to earn $9.50 an hour at MW.
Before you answer with; "How fair is it that the 30 year old gets paid more for the same work as the 16 year old?"
I do have an answer for this.
Responsibility. How much responsibility does a 16 year old has compared to a 30 year old. Who is more likely going to work more hours? Who is going to be encouraged to come to work to make that payment on bills they most likely will have? Do they have children to support?
There is a simply difference that a 16 year old is only working for lunch money, to buy things that are luxury. The 30 year old is going to have to support themselves with rent, electric, a reliable vehicle and other necessary bills just to get through life. Sure, he may not have a diploma or GED but at least he isn't living on the streets and in a cardboard box.
Eh, my thoughts... Except that now you are imposing age limits indirectly to specific industries, especially food service and retail. Which is the underlying issue at hand.
These industries do not have a large profit margin, and if you are going to impose a minimum wage based by age of the employee, you are pretty much forcing these industries to hire only 16 year olds and fire them when they reach the next level. You are basically creating a Logan's Run situation for employment.
And how are these unskilled people without an education going to get a job if they become unhireable due to age? It would be paramount to forcing them to get an education (which isn't a bad thing) or forcing them into welfare (which will more than likely happen).
No, I think it would make the situation a whole lot worse than raising the minimum wage period.
omg what a surprise...
Quote: In a few weeks, Seattle’s new, highest in the country, $15 per hour minimum wage will go into effect. Like many liberal policies, it was passed by City Hall with the best of intentions. The only problem is, in the end, it may do more harm than good for many.
Private businesses, unlike government entities (which, in theory, can always raise taxes or borrow), must make more than they spend in order to pay the rent, make payroll, keep the lights on, pay their business taxes, and, heaven forbid, have some left over for the owners and investors who are taking the risk and putting in the long hours.
Earlier this month, Seattle Magazine asked, Why Are So Many Seattle Restaurants Closing Lately?:
Last month—and particularly last week— Seattle foodies were downcast as the blows kept coming: Queen Anne’s Grub closed February 15. Pioneer Square’s Little Uncle shut down February 25. Shanik’s Meeru Dhalwala announced that it will close March 21. Renée Erickson’s Boat Street Café will shutter May 30 after 17 years with her at the helm…What the #*%&$* is going on? A variety of things, probably—and a good chance there is more change to come.
The magazine went on to report that one “major factor affecting restaurant futures in our city is the impending minimum wage hike.” Anthony Anton, president and CEO of Washington Restaurant Association, told the magazine, “It’s not a political problem; it’s a math problem.” He estimates that restaurants usually have a budget breakdown of about 36 percent for labor, 30 percent for food costs, and 30 percent to cover other operational costs. That leaves 4 percent for a profit margin. When labor costs shoot up to say 42 percent, something has to give.
Restaurants can take actions to adjust, such as raise their prices, acquire cheaper ingredients, and cut their operating hours and labor force. However, all those actions generate reactions from the public which can still lead to lower revenues for the restaurant and, for some, the decision to close their doors.
The Washington Policy Center explains:
When prices rise consumers seek alternatives, a behavior economists call the “substitution effect,” which results in lower demand for the higher-priced product. In the case of restaurants, consumers have access to the ultimate substitution – they can stay home.
A spokesman for the Washington Restaurant Association told the Washington Policy Center, “Every [restaurant] operator I’m talking to is in panic mode, trying to figure out what the new world will look like.”
Seattle had a foretaste of the effect of the $15 minimum wage earlier this year when Prop 1, which made a $15 minimum wage for those working in parking garages and hotels near Seattle-Tacoma International Airport, took effect. A reporter asked a cleaning woman and a part-time banquet server, who work in a hotel near SEATAC, what they thought of the new law:
The cleaning woman responded, “It sounds good, but it’s not good,”
“Why?” I asked.
“I lost my 401k, health insurance, paid holiday, and vacation,” she responded. “No more free food,” she added.
The hotel used to feed her. Now, she has to bring her own food. Also, no overtime, she said. She used to work extra hours and received overtime pay.
“What else?” I asked.
“I have to pay for parking,” she said.
I then asked the part-time waitress, who was part of the catering staff.
“Yes, I’ve got $15 an hour, but all my tips are now much less,” she said. Before the new wage law was implemented, her hourly wage was $7. But her tips added to more than $15 an hour. Yes, she used to receive free food and parking. Now, she has to bring her own food and pay for parking.
The Seattle Times reported that a Clarion Hotel recently made the decision to close its full service restaurant (laying off 15 people) and let go of a night desk clerk and a maintenance worker. It also plans to raise its rates by 10 percent to offset increased labor costs.
As the April 1 deadline approaches, the residents of Seattle will have a front row seat to the effects of the $15 per hour minimum wage, but early indicators suggest it will not be as positive as City Hall intended.
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