Killer Instinct: The Beastmaster Compendium

Well dead bodies can't four step in the first place

0hp is the ultimate skillchain interrupter tbh

Thats why I suggested Nyame. If you die in Nyame during WS, you probably would die anyway.

I know this is the BST forum, but I have a related saying in the linkshell "A dead dark does no damage".

Most linkshells have that saying. It's DRK tho. You either know how to play it and you are probably the hardest DD job to kill, or you don't know and you are probably the easiest DD job to kill :)

Heh...

Come on, who is NOT going to take the risk to weaponskill and pull of BIG damage in that window of a few seconds for a skillchain? Especially if its not a boss mob? 'Trash mobs' in Odyssey seem just as benign as their non-odyssey counterparts, until they unexpectedly lay you on the floor out of nowhere.

FFXI has plenty of examples where the best defense is a good offense. If the mob takes 2~3 weaponskills or 1 skillchain. you are almost always better doing the skillchain and ending it faster. Besides, farming efficiency and time limit in odyssey are another reason you WANT to kill faster... but it only takes being off by a second or 2 for that to fall apart sometimes.

Sure if you want to play it careful, avoiding being in WS gear when an Enemy attack comes thru is not hard fighting a single mob... but how often are you fighting a single mob anymore? The tank is holding a crowd and the dd's go to town to take them down ASAP. You won't keep track of AoE's from the whole crowd when you are trying to take down the mob in front of you quick to increase farming efficiency, lower the burden on the rest of the party etc. Bst isn't the job that is taking them down in 1 WS so much. More likely its the job that can skillchain easily with pet and take stuff down in 1 skillchain.

So Argosy is just a BAD choice. Especially since we got Rage and Frenzy for attack buffs. you get str, attack and DA from argosy. We have alternatives to boost attack now. WSD is better than prioritizing STR/attack anyway. the only thing you need the DA for is Decimation and there are better options for multi-hit already.

If you are in Nyame, you won't notice any risk from taking a hit. If you are in Argosy, stuff you didn't think was a risk is suddenly fatal.

Tbh Rage is probably more risky than WSing naked. Odyssey mobs can do tons of damage when they are at high pdif against you. That's why getting hit by Troll's def down makes you fragile as glass.

Lately when I want a self-buff, I tend to go for Vivacious Gaston's Frenzied Rage. Smaller attack buff (atk+20%), but no defensive penalty like Rage from Sheep (basically a souped up Berserk with an even more harsh defensive penalty).

I find that pretty handy for stuff like Dyna waves 1-2 or Odyssey ABC, where (a) mobs die too fast for a BST debuff to be very meaningful, (b) it's really hard to get the debuffs up in time anyway, (c) mobs can still hit hard enough that a defensive penalty is a serious liability, and (d) normal mobs dying fast and tons of WS being spammed on NM = SC from pet isn't viable. So, I tend to use Gaston for Dyna from entry until wave 2 boss as a buff to myself, then switch to Slug for Def- for the alliance.

I don't often bring BST into Odyssey farming (slashing only, lower damage than heavier DDs with more versatile weapon types like DRG SAM WAR...), but if for whatever reason you're in there on BST the same logic applies.

BST isn't slashing-only, though; we have Tauret as an option, and Evisceration is easy to gear for. Definitely not as high of damage option as the DRG/SAM/WAR but you can make melee BST segment farming work.

Thanks for the reminder, Tauret slipped my mind for a minute there. Not the craziest thing in the world to bring BST to Odyssey. I just tend not to myself, because I have well geared SAM DRG WAR that I generally prefer when I do segments.

Point remains that if you are in there on BST, it's a good example of a scenario where Rage DEF- or WSing in sets with poor defensive stats is taking a significant risk.

Rotating your DD jobs to seg runs is an easy way to get Master Levels on jobs you don't frequently play. 3 good runs gets you to around ML10 without much effort. BST does reasonably well in segments (are people still doing segments FOR the segments?) if you default to Savage Blade, so it's still a useful option.

BST can even solo off on it's own if it has the buffs and your group splits up for different mobs. It's not normally hindered even if the monsters are slashing resistant. Send a slug to attack something, heel it back, ooze, WS, snarl (Ameretat), repeat. Can take out a few monsters while the rest of the group focuses elsewhere.

Not everyone started early doing Segments several times per week. So I bet there is still a lot of people who need segments. Snarl has 30 sec recast. So it would take like 4.5 min to kill 10 mobs like that. Not really great.

EDIT: Also if you split, you will lose EP from mobs killed by rest of the group unless they will be close enough right? That would go against getting those MLs right?

If you're on the bend on C1, any of C2, or the middle area of C3 you're close enough to get chain bonus. Close enough for a mage to run out and toss you a heal if necessary, not on complete other side of the map.

You can also just use Peter for heals instead, and snarl is just a bonus for troublesome groups, not a strategy to rely on. Takes two WS to kill most things and BST like I said it's self sufficient.

I thought the idea was to kill mobs that you normally cant kill without risk on some jobs (Ameretat you gave as example. Tho Ameretat can still be easily killed by many strong DD like Ukon WAR or Calad/Redemption DRK Savage DRG without risk, just with holding TP). I see no good reason to split only for the sake of splitting. BST healing with pet or snarling or w/e is still loosing time doing it, when it could be just killing mobs pulled by tank staying with group. Not to mention loosing time to pull one by one (I assume with pet?) which is really slow too.

Absolutely. The majority of people I know in game are still in a place where segments are a significant concern, and these are people who are fairly regular endgame players (though obviously did not start Odyssey farming early or go super consistently).

Even people who do go more often tend not to be as optimized as you might assume. Sometimes on this forum, there's a not very accurate view that everybody is doing a super efficient 6-man farm multiple times per week, and that's just not the case for MOST people I know. For instance, I find it really common to just go in with a party of 3-4 people who happen to be around and fill the party with trusts (or just go in dualbox by myself on my own schedule). I play with a couple people who go pretty consistently but they just duo it as a more relaxed daily thing. So, obviously those kinds of parties don't get anywhere near as many segments/EP as Buukki is assuming (there's no way in hell 3 runs of that kind of party equals 10 ML).

This is a good point though. Even if it isn't "optimal" segments or as much ML as Buukki mentions, just going in when you have a KI to avoid wasting it is good for something. Segments, MLs, Lustreless items (more for Sheol A/B), Moogle Mastery rankups, some daily gil from the final flux reward... Just entering = better than nothing.

Even so, I still have a bunch of other non-ML20 jobs that I'd probably bring in before BST since they're a bit more efficient at segment farming (SAM DRG WAR DRK RNG COR...), especially if trying to make as optimized of a party as possible. But yeah, people might bring BST and you might as well do something that gets you both ML and other rewards.

I gave Amererat as an example when utilizing one of BSTs tools in Snarl. You'd have Utsusemi anyways, but it was more to illustrate that BST is still very good and self sufficient.

Splitting away if the weapon type is unfavorable is a given, you would do that if it makes sense to. In other instances, it actually improves time splitting, especially if the monsters are close and someone else can handle another pack. There is no reason for 3-4 DD to be killing a group of worms, for example, when they can't move and a DRK or whatever can kill them in about a minute. Imps melt to Blade: Chi, so sometimes on Ninja or even Samurai if I see them nearby, I peel off the main group and take those out because they are so quick. I do the same with Ameretat or Dahaks on Ninja. If a BLU can split off and CH 1-2 groups of monsters (especially on C3/C4), that saves a good bit of time as well. You don't have to be waiting for a tank to pull, BRD to sleep, and then autotarget killing the same group of monsters. Too many times you get TP overkill or lag (at least I do), and you lose your TP because you target something far away. There's no optimal way to do it, but there is definitely a benefit to occasionally parting from the main group's monsters if it will improve your speed. You just have to be selective. Can do it does not mean always do it.

The group I roll with often has the tank run off and grab 1-2 other groups of monsters while the remaining party kills another group. Usually the ones up or down the stairs. The time it takes travelling with the entire group kills your time collectively. Another thing that wastes time is "scouting for the Agon" on C3/C4. The time it takes trying to find those for segments is essentially wasted, as you can just be killing things along the way and net close to the same amount of Segments as you would had you just beelined for the Agon group.

Just suggestions, not rules.

If we're on BST odyseey discussion, I've had some serious fun soloing it as BST through Charm methods.

Go into 2, head to floor 6, then charm something there(if nothing there is charmable, head to 5). Usually takes around 5-6 mobs. Most importantly here, you *have* to charm the mob in one shot and you can't charm anything you've aggroed. If you charm something that's aggroed you, you're not allowed to warp back, because you're still technically on it's hate table.

Once you've charmed something, familiar it, then head back to floor 1. The charmed mob is basically a monster, and I use it to solo a halo, then to work on all the beastmen. During this, I'm clearing out the group around the halo, then I finish off the beastmen, who the pet happily holds and usually gets them all to around 50% or less health.

Between the half group in the process of charming, the 10 on the halo, and the halo itself, that's enough izzat to open a chest and a coffer if both are maxed. So between that and the halo kill, you usually get 2-3 boxes. So around 70 hides, around 100k gil, and I haven't kept track of segments.

It's not in any way efficient compared to 6 man groups, but it's solo and it's honestly fun. I think with 1 other BST you could do two halos no problem. Also my Heyoka +1 has come in major handy here, because the mobs crit for absolutely absurd numbers, and a bunch of crit chance makes them hit super hard.

Kinda love the charm Odyssey farm method just because it's fun to get a chance to use charmed pets.

Not sure what you mean with the quoted piece though. Heyoka set (like Gleti's) has crit rate for master only, not pet. Unless you're just saying Heyoka for the solid master+pet stats but some extra flexibility in capping pet haste?

Whoops. That's me just misreading it and confirmation bias. The Pet Haste is important as well though, charmed pets take buffs super well. Let me see about getting a video up.

Its fun, but seems inefficient even for solo. BST should have no problem soloing more than one halo (I mean halo + several groups) on floor 1 of Shaol B using jug pet and trusts.

Does BST get any use out Cath Palug Ring?

High acc/macc, highest DA in slot for those few multi-hit ready moves

Sets on page 1 of this thread are pretty much up-to-date. You'll notice that C.Palug Ring is in EVERY single ready move set: physical (single hit or multihit), magical, you name it. And it's even more important if you can't justify dedicating Adoulin reward ring to Thurandaut. So yeah, very worth it for BST.

Has anyone noticed since the update that popping UNM and Reisenjima NMs results in your pet despawning when they die?

I was having it on Vimapire, Taelmoth and Crom Dubstep. Please let me know if its just my set up or anyone else is getting this.

Completely separate question: Is MAB always better then Magic Damage+? I was wondering about Ghastly Talthum +1 for ammo for Primal Rend and Cloudsplitter. Pemphredo gives 4 INT and 4 MAB vs 11 INT and 21 Magic Damage fully aug'd. I see the 217 magic damage on Dolichenus, how many magic damage does it take to be more value then 1 MAB?

All pets are despawning

You should look here:
BG Wiki Weapon Skill Damage

Without even looking at MAB, 1 CHR > 1 magic damage (for at least primal rend). MAB is a little more difficult, because it is a ratio of MAB_you/MDB_mob, but generally MAB tends to trump magic damage.

Generally, unless you are boosting up spells with low magic damage (e.g. helix, banish, tier I elemental, some blu spells) you really should never choose magic damage over almost any other useful statistic.

Also happens after BCNM60 when Level Restriction wears off. I lose my automaton after the fight. Someone mentioned it's probably related to ML effects remaining even after a level restriction is placed, though I don't know why Geas Fete/UNM Confrontation would fall under that same category (unless they were lazy and lumped them all together).

These are the same *** that reset aftermath and despawned pets after every battle. (unity voidwatch etc)

Of course they were lazy. Report it as a bug and they'll address it in 2025 as usual.

Thank you. That article doesn't really mention MAB but it links to the magical damage formula page which shows it in the calculation. I would need to try to develop a test of magical damage vs MAB in a slot and do 10 WS each on the same mobs.

Your comment that magic damage is the lowest priority is really all I need to know.

Agreed with this as a general statement, and while not relevant to BST, perhaps also worth noting that Ninjutsu elemental nukes also get a lot out of M.dmg.

@Simonses

What would you do for a AM3 TP set? And what would you sub with the Aymur in that case?