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Fat-shaming More Harmful Than Racism and Sexism
Serveur: Odin
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4013
By Odin.Godofgods 2014-05-22 22:14:29
Change the word fat to pleasantly plump. Mission accomplished.
Quote: I don't like words that hide the truth. I don't words that conceal reality. I don't like euphemisms, or euphemistic language. And American English is loaded with euphemisms. Cause Americans have a lot of trouble dealing with reality. Americans have trouble facing the truth, so they invent the kind of a soft language to protest themselves from it, and it gets worse with every generation. For some reason, it just keeps getting worse. I'll give you an example of that. There's a condition in combat. Most people know about it. It's when a fighting person's nervous system has been stressed to it's absolute peak and maximum. Can't take anymore input. The nervous system has either (click) snapped or is about to snap. In the first world war, that condition was called shell shock. Simple, honest, direct language. Two syllables, shell shock. Almost sounds like the guns themselves. That was seventy years ago. Then a whole generation went by and the second world war came along and very same combat condition was called battle fatigue. Four syllables now. Takes a little longer to say. Doesn't seem to hurt as much. Fatigue is a nicer word than shock. Shell shock! Battle fatigue. Then we had the war in Korea, 1950. Madison avenue was riding high by that time, and the very same combat condition was called operational exhaustion. Hey, were up to eight syllables now! And the humanity has been squeezed completely out of the phrase. It's totally sterile now. Operational exhaustion. Sounds like something that might happen to your car. Then of course, came the war in Viet Nam, which has only been over for about sixteen or seventeen years, and thanks to the lies and deceits surrounding that war, I guess it's no surprise that the very same condition was called post-traumatic stress disorder. Still eight syllables, but we've added a hyphen! And the pain is completely buried under jargon. Post-traumatic stress disorder. I'll bet you if we'd of still been calling it shell shock, some of those Viet Nam veterans might have gotten the attention they needed at the time. I'll betcha. I'll betcha.
But. But, it didn't happen, and one of the reasons. One of the reasons is because we were using that soft language. That language that takes the life out of life. And it is a function of time. It does keep getting worse. I'll give you another example. Sometime during my life. Sometime during my life, toilet paper became bathroom tissue. I wasn't notified of this. No one asked me if I agreed with it. It just happened. Toilet paper became bathroom tissue. Sneakers became running shoes. False teeth became dental appliances. Medicine became medication. Information became directory assistance. The dump became the landfill. Car crashes became automobile accidents. Partly cloudy bacame partly sunny. Motels became motor lodges. House trailers became mobile homes. Used cars became previously owned transportation. Room service became guest-room dining. And constipation became occasional irregularity. When I was a little kid, if I got sick they wanted me to go to the hospital and see a doctor. Now they want me to go to a health maintenance organization...or a wellness center to consult a healthcare delivery professional. Poor people used to live in slums. Now the economically disadvantaged occupy substandard housing in the inner cities. And they're broke! They're broke! They don't have a negative cash-flow position. They're *** broke! Cause a lot of them were fired. You know, fired. management wanted to curtail redundancies in the human resources area, so many people are no longer viable members of the workforce.
Smug, greedy, well-fed white people have invented a language to conceal their sins. It's as simple as that. The CIA doesn't kill anybody anymore, they neutralize people...or they depopulate the area. The government doesn't lie, it engages in disinformation. The pentagon actually measures nuclear radiation in something they call sunshine units. Israeli murderers are called commandos. Arab commandos are called terrorists. Contra killers are called freedom fighters. Well, if crime fighters fight crime and fire fighters fight fire, what do freedom fighters fight? They never mention that part of it to us, do they? Never mention that part of it.
And...and some of this stuff is just silly, we all know that, like on the airlines, they say want to pre- board. Well, what the hell is pre-board, what does that mean? To get on before you get on? They say they're going to pre-board 'those passengers in need of special assistance'. Cripples! Simple honest direct language. There is no shame attached to the word cripple that I can find in any dictionary. No shame attached to it, in fact it's a word used in bible translations. Jesus healed the cripples. Doesn't take seven words to describe that condition.
But we don't have any cripples in this country anymore. We have The physically challenged. Is that a grotesque enough evasion for you? How about differently abled. I've heard them called that. Differently abled! You can't even call these people handicapped anymore. They'll say, "Were not handicapped. Were handicapable!" These poor people have been bullshitted by the system into believing that if you change the name of the condition, somehow you'll change the condition. Well, hey cousin, ppsssspptttttt. Doesn't happen. Doesn't happen.
We have no more deaf people in this country, hearing impaired. No ones blind anymore, partially sighted or visually impaired. We have no more stupid people. Everyone has a learning disorder...or he's minimally exceptional. How would you like to be told that about your child? "He's minimally exceptional." "Oohh, thank god for that." Psychologists actually have started calling ugly people, those with severe appearance deficits. It's getting so bad, that any day now I expect to hear a rape victim referred to as an unwilling sperm recipient.
And we have no more old people in this country. No more old people. We shipped them all away, and we brought in these senior citizens. Isn't that a typically American twentieth century phrase? Bloodless, lifeless, no pulse in one of them. A senior citizen. But I've accepted that one, I've come to terms with it. I know it's to stay. We'll never get rid of it. That's what they're going to be called, so I'll relax on that, but the one I do resist. The one I keep resisting is when they look at an old guy and they'll say, "Look at him Dan! He's ninety years young." Imagine the fear of aging that reveals. To not even be able to use the word "old" to describe somebody. To have to use an antonym. And fear of aging is natural. It's universal. Isn't it? We all have that. No one wants to get old. No one wants to die, but we do! So we *** ourselves. I started bullshitting myself when I got to my forties. As soon as I got into my forties I'd look in the mirror and I'd say, "well, I...I guess I'm getting...older." Older sounds a little better than old doesn't it? Sounds like it might even last a little longer. ***, I'm getting old! And it's okay, because thanks to our fear of death in this country, I won't have to die...I'll pass away. Or I'll expire like a magazine subscription. If it happens in the hospital, they'll call it a terminal episode. The insurance company will refer to it as negative patient-care outcome. And if it's the result of malpractice, they'll say it was a therapeutic misadventure. I'm telling you, some of this language makes me want to vomit. Well, maybe not vomit. Makes me want to engage in an involuntary personal protein spill.
- George Garlin
And for those that don't want to read..
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By Jetackuu 2014-05-22 22:15:59
people everywhere are bombarded with what perfection is supposed to look like Are you as excited as I am to see what DBZ Abridged does to Perfect Cell? Honestly, I've always been a larger fan of Weeklytubeshow than I ever was of Team4Star. Aside from the ones that were done differently on purpose (Piccolo obviously), his voices were way more accurate and his dialog was always funnier to me Hadn't got into those, I'll have to check them out later.
Ragnarok.Tatsiki
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 127
By Ragnarok.Tatsiki 2014-05-22 22:16:39
Whenever I'm working with my friend at the Y, I sometimes act like I'm out of shape (They're heavier set than I am) and the confidence they get from that really helps. If anything, instead of fat shaming like "Stop eating fatty" how about "You can do it and I don't mind helping if you want to give it a shot."
Self-esteem is the big thing here, if they get done jogging 2 miles but then deal with people calling them fat, they'll get discouraged, so I try to encourage my friend that she can do it (But realistically I tell her it's gonna be a long trip but it'll be so worth it) and I think everyone should give that a try instead of shaming people.
I mean, hell they'll even LIKE you more if you're supporting them.
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Bahamut.Ravael
Serveur: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-05-22 22:18:30
I am a large proponent of ignorance-shaming, though.
The problem with ignorance-shaming in general is the tendency to define an ignorant person as anyone who disagrees with your opinion.
Ragnarok.Tatsiki
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 127
By Ragnarok.Tatsiki 2014-05-22 22:21:03
I am a large proponent of ignorance-shaming, though.
The problem with ignorance-shaming in general is the tendency to define an ignorant person as anyone who disagrees with your opinion.
Sadly this is true in terms of politics and religion, hence why I tone out half of the opinions on these forums >_>
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Cerberus.Pleebo
Serveur: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-05-22 22:27:21
You can be knowledgeable on a subject and disagree, which would be the ideal scenario for a discussion on a topic. However, the majority of P&R is spent disputing basic facts with the ignorant so I wouldn't deny the correlation.
Ragnarok.Tatsiki
Serveur: Ragnarok
Game: FFXI
Posts: 127
By Ragnarok.Tatsiki 2014-05-22 22:29:22
Please work on your trolling, it's a disgrace and people from 4chan are laughing at you atm.
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Bahamut.Ravael
Serveur: Bahamut
Game: FFXI
Posts: 13640
By Bahamut.Ravael 2014-05-22 22:48:42
You can be knowledgeable on a subject and disagree, which would be the ideal scenario for a discussion on a topic. However, the majority of P&R is spent disputing basic facts with the ignorant so I wouldn't deny the correlation. I disagree and I am very knowledgable and learned on the subject of pleebo sucking!
You might want to work on your phrasing there.
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Cerberus.Pleebo
Serveur: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 9720
By Cerberus.Pleebo 2014-05-22 22:54:37
Are we not doing 'PHRASING!' anymore?
Lakshmi.Zerowone
Serveur: Lakshmi
Game: FFXI
Posts: 6949
By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2014-05-22 23:22:20
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Serveur: Cerberus
Game: FFXI
Posts: 4415
By Cerberus.Senkyuutai 2014-05-23 02:16:43
Its not my fault you're unattractive. You have more control over that than I do. lol
Point of order. I'm married to a woman who is incredibly turned on by me and through high school and college (all the time of which I've been with my now-wife), I've had to rebuke the advances of several women who society would deem "attractive".
Sooooooooooo.........
Sit on it, potsy. That's so true.
At first I met a few cute women on internet that didn't mind the weight, I thought they were weird women and that it was due to internet. Then I went out of my cave and women that are literally 6-7/10 were actually hitting on me, for many reasons.
Doesn't stop me from wishing I had a few kilograms less, but in the end it did teach me that the women I would deem "out of reach" actually aren't in most situations and that both fat women and real cuties are just as annoying in the end because of this shared mentality between all women, but that's a different story.
I'm more annoyed because I'm straight and have to deal with women than I am of not being able to *** anything in sight like my friend who's a stud. Most of the fat to obese people I know are in the same situation.
That Louie video is right on so many things. Most fat men do not want to date fat girls, and some of us do realize that we're idiots for that, but it takes so long to finally realize it and say *** it. Much like at high school average to below average guys do not want to go out with that weird/somewhat ugly girl because other people will make fun of them.
All about growing up in the end, and dating/being with people for other reasons that just "this is my trophy, watch it, watch it ffs".
Asura.Kormak
Serveur: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 75
By Asura.Kormak 2014-05-23 04:50:40
Comments on previous posts in spoiler.
you can't think one salad will fix the weight it also takes WORKING OUT
Do some research. Changing diet and monitoring not only the number of calories, but the type, is far more influential than time in the gym. On an ideal level -- that is, one that's barely attainable by anyone who isn't a professional athlete -- you'll burn ~450 calories/hr in the gym, and most people have no more than 60-90 minutes to spend in a gym when combined with a real job.
Do you know what 550 calories is?
It's a single milkshake.
You can't consume that and even feel full.
Diet is HUGE compared to working out.
What if I told you its not only the calories burned during working out, but the calories used by the body to repair muscles and the increased metabolism associated with regular training.
That being said, diet is not more important than training just as training is not "HUGE" compared to diet. I have watched many overweight people limit their calorie intake and only eat "healthy" foods and get nowhere. Similarly I've seen people eat far too much unhealthy food (Kebabs, pizza Chinese) and don't put weight on due to 4 day a week training.
If the goal is to lose weight then you need to combine diet with training not just either on their own.
Bismarck.Bloodrose said: »
You want to tell people "go to the gym, you lazy fat-***!" then offer to be a gym buddy.
I have offered to help several of my overweight friends to go to the gym but they always feel "out of place" or that everyone is looking at them. Perhaps some of their stigma is my fault because I stick to my usual weights on my sets and generally they are on much lower, I don't know.
I agree that people can look however they want and the only opinion that matters is their own. If you are happy with yourself, who cares what others think.
However if your choices affect others, such as the plane seat example, then yes, you should be held accountable and for that example pay for 2 seats.
The argument that calling someone fat is more personal than a racist remark is stupid, both are designed to cause hurt to the one on the receiving end. People generally don't think of an entire race when using a slur against someone, it's more of an easy method of causing offence and grief.
I personally don't see how words can harm people. The only person that can let them hurt you is yourself.
1 last point, I don't believe there is an excuse for anyone to look like this:
Leviathan.Chaosx
Serveur: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-23 05:34:22
I am a large proponent of ignorance-shaming, though.
The problem with ignorance-shaming in general is the tendency to define an ignorant person as anyone who disagrees with your opinion. Or people who demand you have a solid conviction on a topic that does not require such a thing. Particularly when discussing things such as politics or religion.
I think it's because the population is too conditioned to think in black and white terms all time. Or maybe they're just looking for the easy answer and any attempts to question it are called ignorant.
Leviathan.Chaosx
Serveur: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-23 05:42:44
That's... interesting.
I'm not sure how you could possibly do porn while going to college and think you're going to be anonymous, but from what I glanced at the story there is more to it than just that.
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby
Serveur: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 971
By Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby 2014-05-23 06:03:54
http://www.brobible.com/life/article/girl-lost-130-pounds-hooters-waitress/
I hope this trend of adding "shaming" to the end of things that people are in order to make them seem like helpless victims is over soon.
If you're fat, you're fat because you don't do enough exercise to counter the amount of calories you take, period. Some people need more exercise than others to counter the same amount of fat, and "willpower" is not entirely a measure of character, but no amount of whining, excuses, support groups, post "likes", or demonizing people who make you feel as fat as you are will fix it.
Nobody can fix it for you, and if you take solace in excuses or the victim mentality, you are less likely to see any positive changes. You just don't want it badly enough.
Leviathan.Chaosx
Serveur: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-23 06:06:31
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: »http://www.brobible.com/life/article/girl-lost-130-pounds-hooters-waitress/
I hope this trend of adding "shaming" to the end of things that people are in order to make them seem like helpless victims is over soon.
If you're fat, you're fat because you don't do enough exercise to counter the amount of calories you take, period. Some people need more exercise than others to counter the same amount of fat, and "willpower" is not entirely a measure of character, but no amount of whining, excuses, support groups, post "likes", or demonizing people who make you feel as fat as you are will fix it.
Nobody can fix it for you, and if you take solace in excuses or the victim mentality, you are less likely to see any positive changes. You just don't want it badly enough. Don't forget a balanced diet too.
Fenrir.Camiie
Serveur: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 817
By Fenrir.Camiie 2014-05-23 06:06:33
Whenever I'm working with my friend at the Y, I sometimes act like I'm out of shape (They're heavier set than I am) and the confidence they get from that really helps. If anything, instead of fat shaming like "Stop eating fatty" how about "You can do it and I don't mind helping if you want to give it a shot."
Self-esteem is the big thing here, if they get done jogging 2 miles but then deal with people calling them fat, they'll get discouraged, so I try to encourage my friend that she can do it (But realistically I tell her it's gonna be a long trip but it'll be so worth it) and I think everyone should give that a try instead of shaming people.
I mean, hell they'll even LIKE you more if you're supporting them.
Yeah, but the goal of a fat-shamer is not to help the fat person. It's to drive them further down the social ladder and cement the shamer's own position on it. The shamer is exerting some perceived dominance over the fat person. The fat person becoming skinny and "attractive" is the last thing the shamer wants. To the shamer, attractiveness is empowerment. No bully wants their victim to become empowered. That defeats the purpose.
Leviathan.Chaosx
Serveur: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-23 06:10:09
Whenever I'm working with my friend at the Y, I sometimes act like I'm out of shape (They're heavier set than I am) and the confidence they get from that really helps. If anything, instead of fat shaming like "Stop eating fatty" how about "You can do it and I don't mind helping if you want to give it a shot."
Self-esteem is the big thing here, if they get done jogging 2 miles but then deal with people calling them fat, they'll get discouraged, so I try to encourage my friend that she can do it (But realistically I tell her it's gonna be a long trip but it'll be so worth it) and I think everyone should give that a try instead of shaming people.
I mean, hell they'll even LIKE you more if you're supporting them.
Yeah, but the goal of a fat-shamer is not to help the fat person. It's to drive them further down the social ladder and cement the shamer's own position on it. The shamer is exerting some perceived dominance over the fat person. The fat person becoming skinny and "attractive" is the last thing the shamer wants. To the shamer, attractiveness is empowerment. No bully wants their victim to become empowered. That defeats the purpose. Not sure if that's their personal goal. Rather I believe it's only done to make themselves feel better at the expensive of someone else. The falling down the social ladder thing is more of an overall collective outcome.
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby
Serveur: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 971
By Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby 2014-05-23 06:13:49
I rather date a fat woman that is fun to be with than a skinny b. Would you rather drown or die in a house fire? Some of the nicest girls I've dated were 8's or better, and I've known a lot of fat B's.
And yeah, American society is losing its ability to cope with adversity. That never ends well.
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby
Serveur: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 971
By Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby 2014-05-23 06:15:30
Sorry, something funny about a fat person falling down a ladder...
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby
Serveur: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 971
By Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby 2014-05-23 06:17:04
I wonder if people ever consider that society evolved to disapprove of certain undesirable traits, and it's not just pure meanness or self-gratification that leads people to act on these disapprovals?
Fenrir.Camiie
Serveur: Fenrir
Game: FFXI
Posts: 817
By Fenrir.Camiie 2014-05-23 06:29:11
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: »I wonder if people ever consider that society evolved to disapprove of certain undesirable traits, and it's not just pure meanness or self-gratification that leads people to act on these disapprovals?
You've got it backwards. It's because we're still caught up in our base tendencies that we act the way we do towards each other.
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Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby
Serveur: Gilgamesh
Game: FFXI
Posts: 971
By Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby 2014-05-23 06:48:06
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: »I wonder if people ever consider that society evolved to disapprove of certain undesirable traits, and it's not just pure meanness or self-gratification that leads people to act on these disapprovals?
You've got it backwards. It's because we're still caught up in our base tendencies that we act the way we do towards each other.
Or is that the arrogance of the current generation thinking it is wiser than our ancestors, while inventing crises for itself?
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Serveur: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-05-23 07:19:52
I am a large proponent of ignorance-shaming, though. So, you shame yourself most of all then.
Yup, you said it yourself!
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Serveur: Asura
Game: FFXI
Posts: 34187
By Asura.Kingnobody 2014-05-23 07:23:40
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: »Would you rather drown or die in a house fire? Some of the nicest girls I've dated were 8's or better, and I've known a lot of fat B's.
And yeah, American society is losing its ability to cope with adversity. That never ends well. *** and *** know no bounds.
Neither fat, skinny, black, white, man, women, Christian, Muslim, Atheist, Texan, Californian, American, Danish, defines assholery or bitchiness.
Edit: thanks Chaos
By fonewear 2014-05-23 07:24:34
Fat shaming you know what that means:
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By fonewear 2014-05-23 07:30:02
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Leviathan.Chaosx
Serveur: Leviathan
Game: FFXI
Posts: 20284
By Leviathan.Chaosx 2014-05-23 07:49:51
Gilgamesh.Tenshibaby said: »Would you rather drown or die in a house fire? Some of the nicest girls I've dated were 8's or better, and I've known a lot of fat B's.
And yeah, American society is losing its ability to cope with adversity. That never ends well. *** and *** know no bounds.
Neither fat, skinny, black, white, man, women, Christian, Muslim, Atheist, Texan, Californian, American, Denmark(ian?), defines assholery or bitchiness. Danish is the word you're looking for.
A new study from the Florida State University College of Medicine suggest being treated poorly for being overweight may hit people harder than acts of racism or sexism.
Quote: From movies to magazines, people everywhere are bombarded with what perfection is supposed to look like, making those who are overweight a punchline.
After what some would consider a hate-fueled rant on national TV this month, the call went out for Charles Barkley to apologize.
Barkley has been getting heat from the city of San Antonio, specifically its female population, for saying, on live TV, that the city's women were a "gold mine for Weight Watchers."
But Barkley is not alone. Just peruse the internet for a few minutes, and thousands of jokes and memes will appear - all directed at people who are overweight.
A new study suggests those comments, looks and jokes could actually be more detrimental to a person's psyche than if they were a victim of racism or sexism.
The study from the Florida State University College of Medicine says it could be because weight is seen by many as something that's easily controlled, whereas race and sex are not.
"I think that because it is seen as a choice and it potentially says something about their personality, people feel more comfortable doing it," said Hailee Bland-Walsh, a personal trainer. Source
An easy target because of perceived changes that could be easily made?
Another article goes on to say:
Quote: "It’s almost like obesity is the last of the acceptable groups to be teasing," says Madelyn Fernstrom, NBC News health and diet editor. Being biased about the overweight or obese, she says, is still very socially acceptable.
Research has already shown that stigmatizing overweight people leads to psychological factors that are likely to contribute to weight gain – things like depression or binge eating. This new paper takes that a step further, linking what the Internet likes to call “fat-shaming” to weight gain and suggesting that you can’t scare people skinny.
“Stigma and discrimination are really stressors, and, unfortunately, for many people, they’re chronic stressors,” says Rebecca Puhl, deputy director of the Rudd Center for Food Policy and Obesity at Yale University. Puhl has studied weight bias and discrimination for 13 years. “And we know that eating is a common reaction to stress and anxiety -- that people often engage in more food consumption or more binge eating in response to stressors, so there is a logical connection here in terms of some of the maladaptive coping strategies to try to deal with the stress of being stigmatized.” Source
So shaming people because of their weight seems to not help them make any changes, but rather forces them to always see themselves as always being fat and accepting it as unchangeable.
Should fat-shaming still be acceptable as the article claims? Is it more harmful than racism and sexism as the Florida study suggests?
Or is there perhaps a better way altogether to tackle the obesity epidemic that plagues the U.S.?
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