Shut 'em Down!

Well, I'm sure to you $400 billion is chump change, but take most of that away and the R&D industry will be hurting.

I'm not jumping around at all, I'm looking at the full picture. Cause and Effect, you know?

Edit: I claim page 101 in the name of....peanuts!

Yet Democrats wanna divide the entire country over how many illegal immigrants? 8 million? As they dismiss 15 million people losing their health care a minuscule number.

So there would no longer be any R&D done by the states at all if we switched over to a single payer system? When did I say it was chump change? When did I say it wasn't significant... your the one ranting about how the world would fall apart if the US didn't carry them in R&D and that appearantly all R&D would cease in the US under a single payer system...

Your first statement said that the US dominated the field in R&D and pretty much carried every other nation in the world... then it was well ok they're the single largest payer but account for less than 30% all together...

Didn't J&J just have to pay over 2 billion dolllars in settlement money for falsely advertising what their pill could do or something along those lines as well?

Nah just want to put them in South East Pennsylvania. Besides who else are Conservative politicians going to hire to raise their children and clean their house?

Where did I say that, by going to single payer, that we would lose all of the R&D funding?

And US does dominate the field in R&D. I was going by memory as to the research I did back in college, and even then, I am probably wrong in some of what I said, which I admitted. But Kara did prove that the US dominates the field in R&D, which I thank Kara for doing.

And what does that settlement have to do with R&D?

Dems are dividing the country over illegal immigrants? You might want to talk to some profit driven businesses that might like to speak to you about their employment practices... if people didn't employ them illegaly they wouldn't be able to stay...

but I guess pubs projecting there theological morality on the nation isn't dividing us at all right? Keeping people from getting married because they're the same sex and making sure that people can't get abortions... but not actually taking any steps to educate them instead telling them that abstinance is the only way! Honestly I'm even against abortions but when anyone sits here and does something because God says its the right thing to do is not the way to legislate for this nation as a whole...

Flav, you are rambling just to argue

You keep noting that $400billion dollar mark and how it would hurt without it... you even made the analogy that the guy who made the biggest donation wouldn't come back the next year if such and such happened... you talked like it would... like if it went single payer it would devastate the R&D potential of the US... but no you didn't specifically state it which is why I formed it as a question...

Amount of money spent doesn't equate to domination... you could spend 400 on something and get crap and spend 100 on something and get gold... in order to prove domination you would have to show the value of the contribution you've provided not just the dollars that you've thrown at it...

I'm not really even arguing against you but you just start throwing ***out there and you're even admitting you're wrong on some of it and then just assuming the rest even though you can't remember a paper you wrote in college correctly...

lol I'm just surprised you didn't say I was personally attacking you because you are always the victim as an upstanding conservative lol...

How in the world did this thread get re-mained?


Isn't that what P&R threads are all about?

I wanted the pleasure of demaining it twice.

/laugh

The second time is usually more satisfying.

I'm reading your posts and I cannot figure out why you are even posting or what points you are even trying to make. You say things like this


You are just fighting to fight. Your last post at me was all over the map making completely random accusations against various strawmen. In four sentences you went off on religion, gay marriage, abortion and education. Might have missed one.

Yeah, I will have to go with Amandarius on this one...

Learn to read then?

Its simple... I'm not even arguing against the point he's trying to make that the US is the R&D powerhouse that he claims it to be or that the world would be lost without us if we went over to a single payer system...

But His arguments for this are all over the place and he even admits himself that he doesn't even really know what hes talking about because his only reference is a paper he completed some time ago that he's trying to reference from memory but failing to do so...

You don't even have to argue against him in this matter as he can't even make a coherent argument...

As for the other reply to you Aman... you talked about things dems are doing to split the country apart... I just named a few the pubs are trying out for themselves... I don't get whats so hard to comprehend about it...

Firstly, single payer doesn't necessarily mean they control anything, especially pharmaceuticals or research, you might want to do some research on what single payer is.

Second, even if they "controlled the market", how do you avoid the paradox of an ultra conservative hating the idea of government spending less on a service they purchase but also hating a corporation not being able to charge whatever they like. Get ready for another double-edged neo-con argument...

I have seen you do the same. Also others.

Indeed the fighting just to fight part is why I often ignored this thread for dozens of pages.

I still think this topic has passed, it is time to move on, and I don't understand why it wasn't locked 50 or 70 pages ago.

because then another thread would pop up with the same illogical unfounded arguments from the severe right, against the moderates while trying to call them all liberalsocialistcommie deviles.

Oh and maybe 1-2 actual leftists.

You can surround yourself with other overweight people to feel thin. You can surround yourself with other liberals and feel moderate.

If you believe in single payer health care, you are not moderate. You are as far to the left as can be. If your complaint about Obama that I often hear voiced here is he is not liberal enough, or Obamacare does not go far enough, then you are not moderate. You are far to the left.

The only people that called names all throughout this thread were the left wing. The only people that called even themselves names jokingly like "liberalsocialistcommie" were the far left; Enu I think.

The left wing arguments get dismantled so easily and it incites rage and nastiness immediately making every thread uncivil and not even noticing how immature and horrible they are being. The goal being to derail the topic that makes them look foolish.

How would single payer health care work in about the fattest, laziest nation in the world, also of over 300 million people. Move to socialized medicine while the dumbest and laziest generation America has ever produced comes of age, yeah great idea.

So we're dealing in absolutes now, I'm sorry, I'm not as narrow-minded as you appear to be.

Obama is a severe moderate, he's a pansy.

There hasn't been a single "left wing argument" that's been torn apart, but as you live in a world of delusion I can certainly see how you believe that.

You keep saying things without backing any of it up with actual evidence.

This isn't the laziest generation, and certainly isn't the dumbest generation, that would probably be the baby boomers.

Oh and it's certainly a fact that the entire political sphere has migrated to the right in the US.

Hence why a republican think tank created idea (including the individual mandate) is touted as socialist evil.

It's sad that you can't admit this, it's time you and the other "conservatives" grow up.

oh and before you come back and call me a dirty liberal, I voted for Barr in 2008, and am very pro-gun, probably more so than a lot of conservatives, as I find that all restrictions on firearms are a violation of the second amendment, and I think that people who try to violate the bill of rights need to be tried for treason, including but not limited to Bush and Obama.

However I'm not backwards and realize that the world changes, that we can't be isolationists in a world economy, not for religious restrictions on people's freedoms, and am not delusional enough to believe "trickle down economics" for a half a second, as there's no historical data to back it up.

There's not a single party that exhibits my position, the major two are way too fascist for my liking, but you're too busy with the "us vs them" mentality that you can't see beyond it at all.

I've said it before and I'll say it again: grow up.

Single payer isn't as far to the left as you can be, there are various conservative leaning countries with socialized medicine. Germany and Russia being 2 examples, Russia's healthcare is marginal at best, but it is straight up socialized, not single payer, which is different. Single payer programs basically put the tab on the government but care providers are not government employees, whereas socialized medicine is generally completely government run. Single payer COULD work in America, ACA is a more conservative approach to the same ideas, care for all, standardized price and practice, force providers to compete for your dollars.

America's social problems definitely have an impact on the effectiveness of a national healthcare program, though.

You also need to separate conservative principles into economic and social, because there a ton of "liberals" on this forum whose economic opinions are moderate or even conservative but whose social opinions are much more progressive. Not everyone clings to the archaic social ideals that the Tea Party rants about.

Republicans used to be the small government personal freedom party, now it's big government personal freedoms I agree with party.

You almost sound mature in this post for the first time and then you end it with "grow up." You are incapable of making a point without attack someone personally or taunting. You can't do it, nor have you once ever backed a single thing up on these forums that you declared as a truth. Never. You can't.

Stop confusing Conservatives with Republicans; and the Tea Party with the religious right.

Obama on Friday, signed an Executive Order taking control unilaterally of the climate change policies of the US. That is not moderate. Look at the task force he put in place, all far left Democrats. Jerry Brown, really? Literally a hippy. This man is not moderate. This is the radical left forcing their religion on everyone else.

I fail to see how conservation is such a slap in the face to a conservative.

It's not.

Wow! Didnt take you long to figure out Aman's entire membership!

...and this thread has gone on long enough. Shutdown has been over for over a week. Create a new thread to banter each other with a random political topic.