[dev1152] Item Levels / Equipment Help Text

I laughed/snorted a bit at this. It's already a huge hurdle for anyone new/returning to really get into playing. People can be extremely picky about what all they want you to have already done before you join an LS to do things. I've actually come across about 4-5 people that were trying to return to the game in the past couple months who seem to have quit again due to that hurdle (not positive about one of them).

I really can't see how it'll make any difference adding item levels due to this.

Maybe people who recently returned to the game should gear themselves first before jumping into the newest content? Abyssea really isn't that hard.

It's too late now, but in hindsight they should have made the Bayld sets strong and varied enough to truly allow returnees and new players to bypass older endgame content.

Right now anyone returning is almost too far behind to ever catch up unless they're returning as a WHM or BRD. If they take time to level, skillup, and properly gear a new job or simply take their older DD job through the old progression they're just going to get left further and further behind. Gear expectations are going to continue to grow and people who are up-to-date with progression aren't going to be bothering with reives, skirmish, and anything that came before.

I think its probably more "need a delve weapon to get into delve to get a delve weapon"

Welcome to Vana'diel.

From some of the official comments it seems like it was actually their intention to have Bayld sets really be appropriate for getting back into the game, but I think the bigger issue really is just that Skirmish didn't really hit it off.

I mean to do skirmish you need several different items, and just looking at the cost of some tier 2 skirmish pieces they're 40k, 70k, and 60k, so it's 170k to enter into a very small skirmish run. Versus doing a plasm farming run which takes a pop item that costs 160k and provides a run that can be used by 18 people versus Skrimish's 6. If the Skirmish items were more common then a lot of these complaints about gearing up probably wouldn't be coming up that much. I am guessing the idea was to have it be that people would go out and farm regular mobs out in Adoulin and maybe find those pyres and get rewards from them like Skirmish popsets and the like, but people only want to solo (slowly) the random mobs in adoulin and those pyres are a pain in the *** to win anything from.

So while the original design probably had Bayld as starting gear and Skirmish as the next gearing tier before you did delve (or wildskeeper though I don't know how anyone would get enough bayld to do that all that often), you have people feeling like they need to skip right from Bayld to Delve.

I believe a lot of returning players are really daunted by the task of tackling Abyssea when the majority of the fan base has moved on from it.

Often I try to encourage these players to do /yell to gather players who need seals/+2/clears so they can go out and do this, but they lack the initiative. I did this when I took a break when Abyssea came out, but when I came back, Abyssea was still very much in the limelight, and because no one can ever be bothered to set up PUGs, I was able to get full alliances to get clears, and the right people to build my afv3.

Abyssea is already easy to those who have done it and know how to do it, but the much more casual player struggles to get through it, and that's when they quit. They get no help, and have to wait long periods of time for anyone to help them, as they can't solo it.

I also encourage them to level BST, as the job can solo a lot of it, but still, there are some NM in Abyssea that still suck, and no ones willing to help them because we are all in delve.

On the same topic, Voidwatch drop rates should also be higher, and more incentive given to playes to help out, so Voidwatch isn't left in the dust also

If more players were able to grind through abyssea at a faster rate, we would get more players into Adoulin and other areas. No idea how they could make Abyssea even easier, but in doing so, it will encourage players to buy the three abyssea areas, instead of getting Karieyh sets and leeching the hell out of delve runs.

Even worse i've been seeing a lot of shouts for 3-4 song bard so returning peoples only option really is as whm or spend who knows how long building empy harp, since newer or returning ppl are the least likely to know how/be able to solo a 90 empy harp in a week like some ppl i know have done.

Voidwatch is also an issue. All the good players who could easily get newer players through the clears are too busy in delve.

I don't play all that much anymore, so whenever I'm on, I am looking for delve, not to help others in content I already helped out on so many times before.

There ain't as many social LS anymore, with leaders who actually go out and help newer members. This was the case back in the day, leaders had the time to go out and help people without effecting their progression so much, but in todays FFXI, you just want to keep up with everybody else, so you need to devote a good amount of time to grinding delve otherwise you may get left behind and unable to get invites.

WOW's battle system isn't to bad it's just the games is to cartoony.

And what's truly infuriating is that while a DD has to meet a ridiculous and unnecessary standard to be accepted in some runs, they'll take any WHM they can get. A WHM who doesn't know what they're doing will kill a run much faster than an "undergeared" DD will. I know, I've seen it. Terrible support with Delve DD? 3k run. Less than optimal DD with good support? 6k run. I'm not good at math, but I'd take the latter if that's what I had to choose from.

Don't remind me of bad WHMs in Delve and especially the outside NMs for the key items. I've had my fair share of bad WHMs since I came back. I like to call them the "Abyssea WHMs" because it seems like they rushed to 99 without learning how to play their job. And, I've wiped more often to those NMs and Delve runs because of these WHMs that don't know how to effectively cure and maintain their MP. And, similarly to the BRDs in Delve that seem so paranoid of sleeping a group of monsters someone has pulled.

Alliance member #1: "Why didn't you sleep the mobs?"
Alliance member #2: "Help sleep!"
Incompetent Bard: "The monster will eat me if it wakes up! That and Lullaby resists a lot!"
Incompetent BRD pees in his/her pants and cries.

Alliance member #3: "Why did you let that PLD die?! He/she was in orange/red HP!"
Incompetent White Mage: "I'm the master of conserving MP, I only cast Cure VI/Curaga IV/V to max it. This prevents me from spamming Cures and saves MP."
Alliance member #3: "Please, someone shoot this WHM."

It gives me a headache.

I've played the game for 7 years, with a two year break, and I've come back to a game populated by players who've rushed to 99 without learning how to play their job effectively and how to gear it properly. You don't have to have the best gear out there, and I can understand if you are still trying to acquire them, or are having difficulty acquiring them. It's why I agree with my friend: raise the damn minimum cap to Abyssea to level 60 or 75, and make leveling in the lesser/lower levels much like the old days-- 6-man parties-- where it would force players to learn how to play their jobs.

However, if I see a WHM full-timing PDT gear and not pulling hate while curing or just using Curaga spells, I think I'm going to kill a kitten.

So, be a good WHM and BRD, or I kill a kitten. And, I don't want to kill a kitten. They're cute and fluffy, and I love them.



Please think of the kittens!

Personally I am tired of having to ask for debuffs to be erased, and having to go half a run with no haste, despite being one of the better dds in the party.

I know I got a great WHM in my party because I don't have to ask for a thing the whole run.

But to be honest, it's bad when I end up being the one doing all the damage and taking all the hate, because i'm a bit of noob compared to some :P

I actually will /bow to or verbally thank a WHM who hastes, because so few even bother to try. Some will literally not cast it at all, ever.

Hard no, annoying yes.

I've seen so many people try to shout for +1 seals or zone bosses but barely anyone helps them. +2s aren't as bad since usually there are people building emps that will shout for help and give them away if they get the emp items.

Let's be honest, newer players or returning players that quit before Abyssea era will not have any of the good atmas which shouts never happen for anymore, so soloing their seals would be hard and new players probably don't have a dual box.

Then by your own admission the WHM would be better to prioritize erases on the people who are the top DDs. You can only cast one spell at any given time so a WHM is only bad if they cast the wrong spell at the wrong time. I don't consider a WHM bad solely on the fact that the party is debuffed. WHM is about making the best possible choice at the given time.

Is the hate holder in yellow, Third Eye down, and mob hasn't done a TP move in a while? May be better to cure him than to Paralyna. But that decision should be made within a split second. On top of all of this, MP management must be taken into account.

Can't consider a WHM bad just because they're not getting lucky with Divine Veil.

Any idiot can play a DD, it takes 0 brain power to have decent gear. You just hit ws macro, ja macro and ignore everything else around you. There are sooooo many DD who don't carry meds, its not even funny. Remedies are your friend.
I personally love getting to play as DD as it means I can relax a bit and smack stuff around without worrying about the other 5 people in the party.

Support roles have to know what everyone else is doing. Who has hate, what moves do what debuff, what DD has terrible (or no) -DT sets, who is doing more damage, how much MP they have, how much HP they have, how much hate they have, how far away the mob is, how far away the furthest party member is. etc. etc.

You should ask people first:
"Do you play the job often? Are you comfortable supporting a full party? Do you have echo drops?(Even if they won't be needed for what you are doing, a competent mage will be carrying them.) Do you now what 20 yalms is?"
Get a no to any of those and they should be on something else. If your support are noob w the job, you're gonna have a bad time.

I love this sort of thinking because it's DD's who feel like this that end up doing 500k damage throughout a run if they're lucky.

Any idiot can do any job to a "functional" level. This isn't exclussive to DDs.

How often do you hear a DD say "Good job mages, if it wasn't for you I'd be doing 0 DPS".
As soon as they have to go through 5 people with a -na and get unlucky on divine veil proc, the DD who gets a -na last starts bitching and moaning that the WHM sucks etc.

All the DD need to do is pop a med if it bothers them so much... If you don't carry remedies, you are as bad as the WHM who carries no echo drops. Also means your mage is less likely to be in the middle of status removal when a big AoE tp move goes off and puts the front line into the red.

Also, I'm not talking about vs fodder.

So true.

If as an Amano 95 I can be in the top 3 of a I don't remember how much plasms, I think we did over 8k, I forgot by now since I stopped to play altogether because of the attitude pointed right here, then the words "ridiculous" and "unecessary" are justified.

I'm probably not the only one, but I'm tired. I have been on a few servers, having to prove who you are every time is tiring after a few years. Meeting these people who are delusional, terrible, yet tell you how bad you are because you don't have X stuff isn't even making me mad, it makes me give up completely. Sure I could play the game for about 2 or 3 weeks and make them understand that I deserve to be in there, but after 9 years of FFXI, it's just too much.

Instead of gearing my WHM, my COR or whatever else, while I have a more than capable Delve DD available, I rather just stop playing. I finally got my key item and I was what, maybe 2k plasm away from Ugui, earrings and some Mikinaak stuff to complete the deal. But just to get these 2k, there is so much convincing to do, or so much stuff that isn't fun to do, that I rather just do something else that is instant fun.

FFXI has become a chore, in the wrong way. The majority of people, good players or bad players, cannot log on the game and experience fun. They just can't. They have at least 4 weeks of suffering to go through, and even the most motivated veterans don't want to go through that.

Only haste I saw in Delve was for Delve weapon DDs. And they still ended behind.

In my opinion, either WHMs should Haste everyone (as it should be), or, if they want to be picky, they have to run a parse to make sure they Haste the right players.

Because either situation not being respected is pathetic in 2013.

Remedies? What about panaceas, holy waters and eye drops and antacids?

I'm sorry while my numbers were essentially in reference to fracture farming the same is true for NMs.

As to the WHM having to spam na/erase repeatedly to the point Accession attached becomes an issue I'd question where the stunners are at as well as why isn't the support (I assume there are BRDs and CORs there even if they're rotating) taking on some of the load to reduce the stress on the WHM. There are some exceptions but that's just it those are exceptions.

To be clear I'm not saying don't bring items to remove stuff but there are times when using said item is a bigger hindrance to your purpose.

sounds like you made the right decision in quitting then.

The demand for leetness is purely from points per plasm run perspective. Why accept 6k when its very achievable to obtain 10k

Agreed with the above on whm support. They do kill runs and they are just as important as a capable dd.

Annoyed you can't get in the leet groups? Make your own pug and accept your 4/5/6k run. Don't want to do it because your lazy and can't be bothered? that's your own fault..

I remember saying good job X when they did an exceptional job, whether it is proper curing, proper buffing and such. But I also remember these people to be only 2 in the years I have spent in endgame, and I have seen a lot more mages than this. It is objectively very, very rare to meet a mage that deserves a "good *** job, mate" at the end of a proper fight. There are just so many things to fill to deserve this, maybe I'm just too picky, but I have a hard time complimenting a mage on his/her healing for example, when the buffing was trash. So the compliment will be 50% positive only (better to add criticism).

That being said, for big fights medicines are usually brought, LSs have plans for them or at least had plans for them up to 2010, when the LSs stopped existing.

This, for a good WHM (good one but with no Yagrush), there might be 1 and at MOST 2 DDs who will think, "Hey, that was a good mage, I didn't have debuffs on me very long and haste was up nearly all the time". The other DD or two thinks to themselves, "They weren't that good, I had debuffs on me for a lot longer than I'd like to have."

You can only choose to please one person at a time.

We require DDs to have Panacea in my shell, but the LS lots minor sellables and unclaimed sellables to pay for them. We also occasionally furnish food (we send meats to our ls cook to male it cheaper)and echos/remedies we often provide since financial resources are not evenly distributed.

Recently we have also begin requiring Mages/CORs to eat tacos and our WHMs bring vile elixirs et for emerncies, but everyone helps each other out with this stuff.

We try to keep it an even playing field so that we favor player skill over resources.

The point I'm trying to make is:
If something goes wrong, blame the mages.
If all goes well, praise the DD's.

I don't think it's fair. A lot of the DD think they are the most important slot in the party because of some random parse.
If a boss puts 2-3 enfeebles on at a time, and the WHM isn't familiar enough with sac > misery > esuna the DD should be using meds, no excuses.

If you are gonna take any random mage then you should be prepared to have to deal with your own enfeebles from time to time. Even with a skilled mage, someone has to be -na'd last. If it's not off after 5 secs, pop a med.
It's not the mages fault groups will take any gimped mage, it's the party leaders fault for not asking basic questions to discern their worth.

My linkshell's motto is "The battle is fought on the front line but won on the back line."

A tank/DD is only as good as his/her supports.

You're right though that people fail to understand this. As I said above, most people are delusional and well, most people are bad. So they will never realize the worth of proper supports.