IiPunch - Monk Guide

Who said that? Are you confusing me with Cherrywhine?

I'm not part of this debate - I'm on my own independent mission to test both out, for my own benefit. I'll let people know what I think suits me, or what I prefer, but I'm not going to argue about it endlessly until someone cries uncle.

Has this all really degraded to punny name-calling? I'm disappointed that this debate couldn't be elevated instead.

hope nothing I said offended you, wasn't my intention at all.
Just saying I'm not in this debate

Controlled conditions for testing DPS are essentially unobtainable. You would need consistant speed in status removal, consistant buff duration, a measurement of engage and disengage time, accounting for mob levels, etc. Unless you thought about all these variables and chose a target accordingly, I highly doubt you've made any sort of DPS test that's worth anything to anyone besides yourself.

This isn't an insult and there's nothing wrong with playing with your gear and seeing how much damage you do. It just isn't considered testing by any reasonable standard, nor is it relevant to the people who do math.

BiS is full kenda+1. There is some debate that in certain circumstances af3 legs and af1+3 feet can produce an exceedingly minor DPS gain, but current simulation suggests kenda+1 doesn't even lose in terms of DPS. Even if it did, you gain too much defensive value by using kendatsuba to bother with the other set.

It doesn't have to win in the spreadsheet. If it makes you resist a dispel/amnesia/stun etc. it will already have made up the DPS loss.

It's all good. :)

But, yeah, may as well wrap up this debate. The point is to do someone, anyone, some good. But I think it is well beyond that point.
Some value increasing their DPS when they are a DPS, even if only a small fraction of an amount, over other stats if said other stats are not necessary.
Some value other stats over full-blown DPS, as long as said hit to DPS is within some self-accepted minimum amount, for additional safety just in case.
And some are just crazy, and prefer Strawberry icecream over the other two flavors in a mixed carton.

Cherry's point was basically "***is situational" which is really hard to disagree with in FFXI. It's DPS loss if target has absolutely zero dispel/amnesia/stun moves.

the only reason hose and gaiters were brought up in the first place is because pchans model had several errors. nq kend is the same damage with better defensive ability if acc and attack are capped with both sets. and hq is even better than that.

Yea, but the DPS loss (if it even exists) is essentially nothing. I'm really surprised to hear you siding with what was hypothetically a 2% DPS increase over allowing your mages to relax as much as everyone else. (If you take out the possibility of debuffs.)

If I could wear anything, this would be my TP set, assuming no accuracy issues. I'm missing two pieces of this. (Well, three, since I haven't made the feet yet because I'm lazy/inventory).

ItemSet 352604

Yup, no lazy/alt tab/social butterfly mage allowed! :)) I'm just that evil.

Thanks for sharing and being relevant. Everyone seems to just want to stroke they're egos and seem like their informed and 1up u or put u down

Even though I've said repeatedly these tests are for me.

My issue with maths and simulations in FFXI is and always has been this - its not accurate enough to make me follow it blindly. SE have access to the backend and all the true equations for how things are calculated and what the variables are. With that, they still have repeatedly failed to balance jobs, and many times jobs outperform or under-perform what they had intended.
So I use all resources available, and one of them is reading the number crunchers findings and another is going out and seeing actual performance in conditions that are relevant to the content i participate in.

Its not a science, but anyone who's played with me in game over the years will say I'm no push over.

Don't think you'll find many people supporting eyeballed damage and parses over math/simulation/spreadsheet. Have no doubt by your group's success you still do well though, so if it's what you feel most comfortable with there's certainly not a problem with that.

Simulations are meant to account for everything SE's back end does, including real combat oddities like changing targets. The only limitation to their accuracy is our understanding of damage calculations, which is essentially complete at this point.

show me jinpu BiS pls.

Also, again, Austar correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't your first test comparing:

NQ Ken. head, body, hands, legs and feet
vs.
NQ Ken. head, body, hands and Empy +1 legs and AF+3 feet?

It wasn't to show HQ Adhemar head and hands inferior.
I don't expect a big difference to show in the simulation, in either case. But I hold the proposed ideal TP set to be superior for the purpose of DPS.

I don't know what you think asking me to waste my time on a job I have no interest in accomplishes. I can tell you how the damage is calculated easily enough, though.

Take weapon base damage. Calculate fSTR. Calculate WSC (30% of your STR). Add both to weapon base damage. This is your modded base damage.

Apply any ftp modifiers. Calculate the damage from your 2 swings(first is modded base damage * ftp * pdif, second hit is modded base damage * 1.0 * pdif). Account for any multihit procs.

Now, using the result as your base damage value, follow the magic damage formula to get effective damage.

It's not necessary about lazyness. Sometimes it's a choice between removing a debuff or someone dying. Some debuffs can't be removed. Sometimes it's not possible to fix. If you lose a samurai roll and the corsair/other DD don't. If I have 2 SV madrigals on and you lose one I can't tell which it was and recasting it may be detrimental. I either have to get lucky or change to something else. Also your mages are only human (for the most part) and aren't infallible (and can still crash if they are) so increasing survivabilty isn't a bad thing.

Cherry's set is a significant loss of magic evasion: 168 if I can math. If it's not a significant boost in damage it's not worth it in my opinion.

You and I, and many here, are saying the same thing just in different ways.
If you don't need the additional magic evasion, and many times you won't, take the extra DPS because more DPS when DPSing is always useful.
If you need the additional magic evasion, by all means, wear the additional magic evasion.

Only you are saying this. The vast, vast majority of content will benefit from it.

You didn't get the point, then!


I mean, if you're more comfortable with more magic evasion because all the content you do needs it, then by all means go for it. But such situation may not apply to everyone.

If you want to cp on MNK, why the hell not.

And only you are recommending using MNKs on Teles.

Never recommended it, listed the content where melee are a popular and accepted strategy, one of which is Teles.

I'm going to guess you don't want to put the entire discussion on on the basis of 'is this the best job for the event', because when 2% DPS beats out extra survivability you damn sure don't want MNK at that event.

Posted in a MNK forum.

Ok, so we're only looking at mobs where MNK is the best choice. I must have missed that, my apologies. As MNK is chosen over the higher DPS DD for survivability, there is no need to ever use anything besides kendatsuba. Discussion settled awesome ttyl!


(You also completely ignored that the updated simulation not only puts NQ kendatsuba at essentially the same damage as your mixed set, but puts HQ significantly ahead.)

Let's be real here, if you bring MNK to event it's probably because you want to play MNK to begin with.

If you have access to every job in game and don't have specific preference on jobs, there's almost always better/more efficient choice.

In that case there's no point to base the discussion on 'is this the best job for the event'. Majority of playerbase probably just bring MNK to Cp, have parse competition against their LS mate or friend on crabs or bats and have a good time, then job change to SMN on T4s.

There is an updated simulation posted between all this nonsense? I'm not seeing it.

http://www.ffxiah.com/forum/topic/36705/iipunch-monk-guide/143/#3278969

You responded to it, guess you were too focused on your argument to actually read the supporting information from the opposition. I'm sure Austar would be more than happy to give you the latest version and a list of corrections that were made, if you're even capable of using it.

/sadface because its so true ; ;
If SE doesn't nerf SMN soon, we're doomed...

Look up.

I'm only skimming over your debate with Cherrywhine. I have to say, the dude has earned my respect for tolerating you for this long. Can you not speak without getting personal? Every time you resort to personal insults and condescension is a moment you're saying you are an inferior human being who needs some kind of reassurance, its fragile behaviour.

Debate the issue without getting personal.

Develop your EQ.. show some class.