You Spoony Guide! - A Troubadour's Libretto

That's who i mostly been buying from since the only person actually doing VW it seems :/

There were like 1-2 people who bought I the majority of my plates from. I spent more than I really wanted to, but in my mind it's still worth it in the end.

Not sure what makes you think you have the right to make presuppositions about what I do with my character or how I play it. Your assumptions are all flat out wrong. I must have got you flustered to see you type up this load of crap.

First, I do care about bard. And yeah, if getting a 90 harp doesn't take much, then there is no point in adding one in SoA. Herpaderp. I've seen/heard people doing the harp/shield in one weekend. I've also seen/heard people taking months to do it. Doesn't matter.

It's not that I don't want anyone else to get it. I don't give a crap what other people do with their characters (excluding the people I know/care about). I just think it's stupid to have a 90 Daurdabla, with a different name, drop from a (more than likely) 30-60 minute fight. Not only is it a waste of time for SE, but it makes recent Daurdabla users feel like they wasted their time too.

I do give 2 shits about bard, that's why I have focused on other items. If you took 20 seconds to look before just smashing away at the keyboard making wild accusations, you can see that I actually just got 3 upgrades to my magic accuracy set for Bard within the past few days.

Anyway, when AA shouts were all the buzz, I couldn't get my 2-song Bard in to anything bigger than Normal Difficulty runs. It was always "3+ song BRD" so I took the time to slowly grind away at Daurdabla for a couple hours after work each day before events. Daurdabla enabled me to get invites to Difficult and Very Difficult AA fights, be successful in those fights, and also provide an extra 3-song bard for my LS when they need it.

So I feel a sense of accomplishment at grinding through those trials each day until it was complete, and I feel now that "Dang I could've just waited a few months and had it fall in my lap."

However, this is all based on the assumption that this new instrument will be another Daurdabla. Who knows? Maybe it will be an instrument that everyone can use as an additional song. If that's the case, I'm totally fine with it. My bard will become more useful to my LS. I guess either way, my alt bard will become more useful as well since I never did finish his Daurdabla.

Seems to me like a lot of assumption is going on here, what is making everyone think that "songs +1" means "grants an additional song" ?

To me songs +1 means like a lesser version of

Gjallarhorn

which states exactly "songs +2"

not

Daurdabla

which specifically states "grants an additional song"


Is it just because they reference the harp quest, help me understand?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxi/threads/39346-Future-Plans-for-Equipment?p=498271#post498271

Thank you!

You are just forgetting one thing. Just because nowaday most like anyone who normal setup can beat delve, that totally dont mean it was always like that.

I think it took like 6 months to delve wins to become anything certain, plus a couple of months till it became normal the winning. And in 6 month it took to actually beat tojil, anyone could make any mythic they want, so you could say, at some point, delve weapon were way harder to get than rem.

So, its not like "a new instrument is released, gonna get it today". If the new event is minimally planned, it wont be simply come-and-get stuff, though SE have been becomening weak to dose difficult in event. Things like people saying they beat all ark angels before 24h of release show ark angel is somehow a fail event, just lasting due to random nature of drops.

Yeah it's very possible. I know we're all just speculating at this point. I'm not going to change my opinion though. IF the instrument is only good for non-Daurdabla bards, and IF the instrument is a drop from content that isn't as difficult as SE hopes it will be, then I'll still be annoyed. Otherwise, it's whatever.

Would be great having a delve that would take months till people figure how to win, but thats totally impossible at this point. Unless new delve be ilv140, players gonna destroy poor delve yumcax/hurkan/kumhau in less than a week.

See i always thought rem's were a way that SE said hey you guys are dedicated you deserve to do just a bit better than the casual player base. So OK now we are closing the gap, so the people that pay the same 10 dollars to play a "MMO",( even though they dont have the time to play said "MMO") feel like they aren't being cheated for not putting the same hours into a weapon that someone who does want to surpass the common player does put in. With that said, where is my club that cast a *na spell on my whole party cause i don't wanna make a mythic i just want stuff handed to me in normal content with little to no effort. Ty SE i'll be checking my inbox.

Tekiya isn't the only person doing voidwatch, it's a resell mule that buys all the plates that get listed to mark them up. For what it's worth, I got 1500 plates in under a month on leviathan(<50 from vw) for my second harp. They aren't THAT rare, they're just expensive.

SE's perfectly capable of making difficult content, how many people do you know that beat VD kamlanaut? How about without cheat buffs? However, it makes no sense to make delve impossibly hard, they want people doing it.

Nothing wrong with an alternative to 90 daur, gear gets outdated all the time. This isn't even outdated, as the alternative won't be able to be upgraded to 99/4song. Silly thing to complain about, it just means PUGs may be less screwed in terms of finding multisong brds.

Damn your common sense.

I think a lot of the angst over an easy alternative to Daurdabla (or Ochain, if that ever happens) isn't only because the old item can be replaced, but because a lot of people made them after Seekers replaced everything but the harp and shield.

Harp and shield have always been in something of a separate category with respect to the other Empyreans (requiring the awful VNM system but barring cooperation, long spawn timers for the mobs that drop souls instead of an easy force pop with 3 ???'s, no upgrades past 99 like the other weapons), so it's easy to see why people might feel like they were tricked into spending time on a "safe" option that turned out not to be quite so safe. Obviously the same argument was heard all the various times that RME weapons were threatened, but the way that SE has treated instruments and shields (especially recently) makes them a little different in my opinion.

Gjallarhorn and Aegis survived the initial release of Empyreans, which shat all over the other relics at first and had everyone up in arms. Daurdabla and Ochain, on the other hand, were specifically designed to complement their relic predecessors rather than to replace them. The harp/shield path is widely regarded as the most troublesome, and I think this is why--SE has treated the legendary instruments and shields as part of an innately complementary set. Due to the way that instruments work together, it simply makes more sense to add new functionality than it does to outright copy the defining gimmick of an old piece.

If you think about it, every RME piece has a gimmick. Aside from the shields though, no single piece was ever as close to being mandatory for its respective job as Daurdabla has been for BRD. This is the root of the problem, to be honest. Other jobs had their choice of trials for weapons that were usually good enough for new content, but Daurdabla bottlenecked the ***out of BRD. After SoA came out and the name of the game was "byyyyye RME," we might have expected a change like this. It didn't come. Even after all the updates we've had since then, not once had the topic even been broached. It was like SE had jumped on board with the rest of the playerbase saying "get Daurdabla or gtfo! We've had our way with RME, but this ***is here to stay!"

So yeah, Daurdabla was a problem that needed to be fixed. I'm glad they're doing something about it, but I wish VW was less dead so that the poor harp could at least have a reasonable chance of being somewhat better at its own damn gimmick lol

Orison Cap +2

Although I'll admit that the proc rate on RNG Divine Veil should be improved, optimally by adding a bit more gear. But, either way, SE already gave you an R/M/E bonus on a relatively easy-to-acquire item that is, itself, so old that it should be replaced, too.

Crazy idea: instead of latching onto the "I have this thing and no one else can have it" mentality, latch onto the "SE, would you fix the issues you've made" one, instead. 5-star content and/or doing iLevel 119 Delve with iLevel 103 gear is why people clamored for Daurdabla Bards and this is SE redressing the balance.

bihu cannions +1 should win for Debuffs now over Brioso +1. 10 Chr vs. 2 Skill, plus the Bihu Cannions have some nice other perks (PDT-4%, INT+44!! for Shattersoul shenanigans, SV Duration+, insane for /whm Debuffs!)

artsieq boots with Rank B Path should beat out Bokwus for debuff acc as well.

gwati earring with Musical should beat old earring pair of Psystorm/Lifestorm.


There are some other goodies this update for Brd, but for song debuffs, these are the relevant ones.

I imagine when SE gets around to making 119 Empyrean Armor, they will overcompensate and make the "Augments Divine Veil" proc = Yagrush. I'm only half-joking, too. I'm <20 assaults from finishing mine and have played this game long enough to know that the minute I finish making a mythic I've lusted after for ages(probably just after I turn in Alexandrite #30,000), SE will make my efforts obsolete or attainable elsewhere. That model is becoming the standard for today's FFXI.


Did they say that the new instrument would definitely not stack with a 90 or 99 harp? I've heard people fervently arguing that there is "impossible/no way" they would stack but has SE said otherwise?

Nothing said so far.

Seems like the smart thing to do would make it stack with daur (even tho 5 songs - holy ***that'll be annoying)

Daur owners win, with no crying that super annoying pink harp is replaced, and non-daur owners win.

Who knows with se though :/

Edit: I can't see them giving much more enhances divine veil stuff, considering that's the only gimmick for yag.

I'm surprised there is consideration that they will make Daurdabla stack with the new one. It goes against the logic of how it works in the first place. Consider as a parallel THF relic hands. You can't get relic +2 and tag a mob and then put on NQ relic and tag the mob for ANOTHER TH, just doesn't work that way. Plus, the entire reasoning behind adding this is to level the playing field, not make a vertical improvement across the board.

Hell... Even though I own a daurdabla, I'd be slightly annoyed at ANOTHER song. I mean I love more songs but each song means 2 more casts. And it already takes too damn long to put up songs.

Why not :

Make daurdabla tradable like all other empyrean weapons for their WS.
Players doing so will get the effect of 3rd song as a job trait. No more need for the harp except if you want the song duration and +skills.

edit: To dig deeply into this, the new instrument would not grant a 4th song. Only daurdabla 99 would. Just like empy WS are best used with 119 empy.

This way everyone wins.

Omg this would be fantastic.

No, just no.

I very much doubt they would stack. I obviously don't have the source code but I believe this is how the logic works right now:

each instrument has a max_song count. i.e. currently non dharp is 2, dharp (let's just assume dharp 99 in this situation for simplicity) is 4.

So if current song buffs = 2, on normal instrument it'll try to overwrite a song, if dharp and buffs is less than 4, it'll apply a new song slot.

Reason I think that is if you think about clarion call, if you sing 4 songs on dharp then sing the fifth on ghorn, it won't unlock the 5th slot. It only unlocks if you sing the fifth song on dharp (or sing 3 ghorn song then sing the last 2 on dharp), i.e. your max song slot becomes 3 and 5 respectively.

Similarly, the new instrument's max_song would be 3. So if you sang 3 song on dharp, you already have 3 song slot active thus it should try to overwrite a song. The only way it would stack with dharp is if SE makes the logic to check if you own a daurabla and if song buff <= buffs you can sing with your daurabla, then add a new song, otherwise overwrite the song. this is waaaaay more complicated and pointless. The reason for this new harp is the same reason as why we have delve weapons being on par or slightly inferior to R/E/M. It's so people don't have to back track the content if they don't want to.


Of course this is only my speculation. ^^

Um, or they could just make an instrument that adds an additional song buff and then add in appropriate exceptions.

e.g. can't add a song that's already on someone, can't add more than one additional song, etc.

Isn't this speculation easily settled by someone with a Daurdabla who doesn't mind burning some bayld on camaraderie harp to see for themselves in a reive? Would be a way better tradeoff than wasting time on this new instrument only to find it doesn't work lol, unless SE comes out and says something.

Daurabla99 and Camaraderie harp don't stack. I doubt 90 does either but I couldn't say.

Then why the *** are you anywhere near ffxi because horizontal progression was the one selling point of ffxi over newer, better executed games with better graphics, more immersive worlds, less archaic battle systems, and support and dev teams that aren't player punchlines

If you're after WoW, WoW does WoW better than neo-ffxi ever will.

Two weeks you spent crafting that argument? Impressive.

Counter-argument: in something that is still actively developed, idly accepting bad design instead of encouraging improvements makes one an accomplice in failure. I'd add more, but this is neither time nor place.

By that logic, you should find every bad MMO that is still being actively developed, play it, and hang around each of their (unofficial) forums complaining about them in the vain hope the dev team will take notice of your complaints and "improve" accordingly so you can avoid being an "accomplice to failure" in each of those cases.

Do better.

As for the age of my essential argument, I've been making it in some form since SE decided vertical progression was a good idea.

I don't understand all the QQing, the dharp is superior at 99 if your super serious about brd you would take it to 99.

This new harp enables players who wouldn't deem brd as a main but used it if a group couldn't find a brd be adequate in terms of number of songs.

IF I lvld brd purely for that purpose id never consider it to be a main but I want it geared fairly decently.

The new harp will do its job, if any dharp owners feel shitted on then you need to look at how seriously you take the job. Its up to you to go that step further and become a "awesome" brd rather than a "decent" brd.

I highly doubt the new harp with have increase song effect duration on it either... another reason dharp is better.

That only makes it "harder" to overwrite songs(more noticeable w/ 99 harp, that you need a gear set with no duration to cast dummy songs), but SE should fix that on Monday's update...