PLD Vs NIN...Who Is The Best Tank?

CAN I SAY LOL to "and overall better damage" No offense but your playing the wrong game if your think a Pally is doing better damage than a NIN. Either that or sleeping.

I agree with others it depends on what you taken. Most PLD's suck the big ocean blue if they dont have a BRD, COR or RDM with them. That puts them in a fail situation for me right off.

I am a NIN but a tank, prob not. Can I tank yes, Have I tanked yes. Have out held hate off PLD's god yes. But PLD job was designed to be the Def party memeber. So very good debate but right off I see a LOL on PLD's out DD a NIN.

just remmber a stun can dish out as much hate as a flash, it really dosnt matter if it is resisted or not, your using it for hate.

Thats why nin/drk cast bind and sleep on stuff, even tho obviously they wont land, they still biuld hate.

But Pld is way easyer to play, an exseptional pld can probly tank what a boss ninja can tank, equaly.

But as you can see, SE is trying to shift nin back into the tanking phase, with the mythic weapon and its +10 enmity, who knows maybe this update might do just that.

LOL Ces - How many PLD's are looked for at lvl 75 to go merit? I beleive even you yourself are seeking party to find as a PLD in a EXP party but NIN is automatic YES. They have incoming voke to pull off BRD pulling in and and they hold just enough shadows for the mob to fall. -0 - rest time = higher limit points.

Actually blu/drk isnt half bad... 2 reliable stuns and if I wasnt a taru souleater multihit spells are kinda cool

Ok so... as a noob, im training DRK and am quite interested in taking nin up after THF and DRK, never really heard of Nin/rdm and Nin/drk, but i like the sound of them alot... what are the main merits of each? and are they just for 75 or could i sub them before 75?

Dispel (RDM 32) has a large CE side (320?) and Blind is also huge for Enmity. Blind is almost free as far as MP if you have refresh (5 MP) and the recast is so short that with literally any amount of haste, you can spam it nonstop when you're not doing other things. Bind and Sleep have longer recasts, but also are good for hate.

These are part of the hate tool set that a PLD/RDM uses, I can't imagine a NIN/RDM not doing the same thing.

One of the things I see NIN/RDM used for is soloing/lowmanning things that have horrible TP moves (Ash Dragon, Vivacious Vivian, and probably could be used for Cassie), by using Level 1 Katanas and letting Enspell Damage do the work.

RDM/NIN can actually do this for effect also, especially with Enspell II. RDM/NIN with haste gear, En-II and fast, low-end daggers can shred things to bits without letting them get any/much TP.

As far as seeing NIN/RDM for something like Ultima, haven't seen it done, but guess it could work if done right. Still would need a CB set, but NIN gets something that PLD and RDM don't for that, which is Kirin's Osode (+50 Light Resistance FTW).

Low man inside jailers. Possibly Khim (that would be fun)
And other stuffs.

Most of the time on long fights, Nin will not be a good DD since your tanking gear =/= DD gear. You will also hit for ***and juts feed the mob stupid tp with your fast *** attacks.

Nin/Rdm just like Rdm/Nin has stupid *** recast on dispel and can spam that to hell and back.

Just throwing it out there, but didn't the LS that took down PW use SAMto tank? Come to think of it, seem to recall reading about SAMs tanking Ixion.

I know it's crappy that Seigan halves your Third Eye merits, but that's probably because SE realizes that SAM with 20 Sec Third Eye would be pretty broken.

I used to have a "tanking" set for SAM, but never saw myself using it, so I sold off bits and pieces that only served that purpose.

These are strictly endgame subs used only for tanking big *** mobs that take a while to kill.

In the early 50's you can sub blm and use staves and be a nuking DD, but for the most part you will sub war only all the way to 75.

The merit of these combos over say nin/war is they make better hates. All ya need to know for now lol.

Fixed that for you.

This isn't about Merit points. Two different things are being talked about here: End Game and Exp Pts. NIN is the situational job here. Said this because PLD has more uses overall.

And no this isn't about NIN or PLD fanboys >.> get that out of your mind.

They're pretty much just for 75 under certain circumstances, you won't ever use them in an EXP PT.

Enmity is broken down into 2 types. "Volatile Enmity", the 'here and now' of hate, and "Cumulative Enmity", the 'resentment' factor.

JA's give VE, and no/almost no CE. Provoke offers a large chunk of Volatile Enmity, but leaves no Enmity after 30s is up and it resets to 1.

Spells from /DRK and /RDM produce a lot of CE, this lasts after a period of time has passed.

Wiki has a pretty decent set of numbers up for the sort of hate you get off some commonly used JA's and Spells.
http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Enmity_Numbers

No-ones really talking about merit situations, still, I've merited with pld/nin before and still kept an endless chain.

Also, our usual nin/drk kirin kiter has landed bind a few times lol.


My drk is level 1, if you can't rely on head butt to stun then leave it to other jobs. I've heard souleater is good for some big numbers, but considering I pull hate on damn near everything with one spell as it is, this would be suicide. When I used to do dynamis there was a guy that came blu/nin and set all his aoe spells and just spammed them and stun. All I can say about that is that it was damn funny when the blm's failed on sleeping everything for a few seconds. Bye bye blu.


Really just for end-game as good ways for nin to keep hate. Nin/war only has damage and voke for hate, other DD's will out DD a nin easily and voke only gives what's known as Volatile Enmity, which degrades over time. Stun/sleep/bind/dispel all give Constant Enmity, which does NOT degrade over time, giving a nin a much better way of not only gaining, but holding hate. The job abilities or /drk also give a heap of hate, although I'm not sure if they're CE or VE, but it helps explain why drk's pull hate and die so easily.

Fail lol.

Pld are great HNM DD's on anything they can engage on.

Attoment {you can have this.}

Ty.

Explained it better than I did, but the information on wiki for enmity is soooo fail.

For everything, I repeat, EVERYTHING, you will EVER need to know about enmity, and so, SO much more, go to the original source: Kaeko's Enmity Testing

RDM, undoubtedly. *** Aegis :( I feel bad for everyone who wasted currency on that thing

Maybe you missed the Topic all together. The Topic is who is the overall best TANK. It is situational and PLD do fail on a Merit party!

You honstly belive a PLD and out DD a NIN. Wow you sure you playing FFXI!

Maybe you missed the topic altogether yourself. Merit parties are loltank and I'll happily tank most of them on blu just as well as nin will. Aside from the initial voke, nin ain't gonna be holding hate of ***in a merit party anyway.

Edit: Fail to your second post in every way possible. He said PLD kicks nin's arse at DD on HNM because of atonement. PLD also feeds a lot less tp. Again, situational, but you seem to be missing the point... in fact, you seem to have missed every point that anyone has made.

lol I think you need to reconsider who exactly is failing here.

This thread was born dead.
there are situations where *** rdm can tank best... it's so SITUATIONAL it's not worth discussing.

fixed again ^^

Yet here we are at the end of page 3 :D

Just depends on how you look at it. If your looking at each situation unto itself then yes it would be situational. However if you were considering all situations you would pick one ahead of the other.

This thread has inspired me to make a blu tank build...

I know it can be done, I just don't see the point when pld/nin does it so much better. Head butt is the only advantage we have over pld, and that's not going to save your *** in any serious tanking. Having said that, I'd like to try making an MDEF tanking build for blu/rdm maybe. Saline Coat is awesome.

I've survived CB twice as blu/nin which is what makes me think of the potential here. Although one of those times was thanks to my HP build, and the other I think was a glitch, yes, I cast saline coat right at the last instant, but I didn't even get damage show up on the chat-log... maybe I evaded O_O

RDM/NIN

yay for not so much as skimming any of the previous conversation!

On HNMs? Definitely. Atonement is so broken that people have put their Hauteclaires in storage and tank using Joyeuse. Obviously this is no good on mobs where the PLD can't melee but the same thing would apply to NIN.