The Sealed Dagger: A Ninja Guide
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The Sealed Dagger: A Ninja Guide
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 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-20 21:13:36
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Thank you for the detailed post capuchin I really appreciate it :D

I realiize NIN isn't a popular tank these days, I'm just one of those that if my job can do something, I wanna do it as good as I can or at least know in what way I am lacking and can improve. I tend to favor bettering some jobs I've invested a lot in over just gearing another job for one duty (often not well), etc. I think evasion tanking is not popular but very viable at times, a few things make me think that. The first being when zi'tah came out and they had just added the puks watching people die all the time and my thf was capped evasion and didn't have problems pulling etc. Of course, now that means far less both cuz the people I played with progressed and gear is stronger. Another instance that makes me think that is I know at least 2 DD that have done mambo's and slip on Glazemane as viable ways to beat him. Maybe it will come back :D Maybe not. I just like to keep things in my back pocket, and push what is possible on a job even if it's not well thought of. I get some of my most fun experimenting around and trying things tbh. your info was a great help thank you.
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 Asura.Nilats
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By Asura.Nilats 2016-09-20 22:17:49
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My addition to this discussion, last night doing SR group wasn't terribly geared looking to zerg down with 4dd+whm+geo. We cleared first run without much issue but for w/e reason on 2nd run DD were dropping like flies..

We made it to Round 2 about 30%.. 3 dd dead and me on NIN, I was able to tank Morimiar with mix of San/Ni and migawari without any issue actually able to solo him down while rest of group recovered. (some poor decisions on other DD part to try and re-engage meant multiple deaths and even longer times to try and stabilize) When round 3 popped Arciela engaged and I was able to hold on to her and keep damage down for a while, it eventually became too much to handle and we wiped/disbanded.

Point being, I am much like you Verda like to do everything I can do to max the job, have some tanking gear but would really like to expand that so that when these one off jacked up situations go down i have all the tools to try to help us recover. I genuinely think we could have beaten that SR had the DD rested and unweakened before rengaging.. think it just had to do with people being so unfamiliar with NIN tank they felt they needed their DPS to kill monster faster.
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 Quetzalcoatl.Langly
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By Quetzalcoatl.Langly 2016-09-20 23:52:40
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I haven't had too many fanciful activities, the most fun I've had in this generation of FFXI:

Trio'ing SR > NIN WHM GEO (#merfnulsums)
Being included on Melee Zerg strategies
Tanking Erynis when a RUN wasn't available (never touched! HA)

Other than that, I'm on PUP for Albumen/Teles etc for tanking. Or COR for support.
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 Phoenix.Capuchin
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2016-09-21 00:29:11
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Verda said: »
Thank you for the detailed post capuchin I really appreciate it :D

I realiize NIN isn't a popular tank these days, I'm just one of those that if my job can do something, I wanna do it as good as I can or at least know in what way I am lacking and can improve.

Oh yeah, totally get it. I also like to at least have my NIN ready to tank when the situation calls for it, and it is good in certain scenarios (and can still be competent even in things other than ideal situations). Tanking a lot of 135+ NMs is probably not terribly realistic, and you're really going to end up wasting the other people in your group's time though. It's pretty fun for stuff like lowman 128 and under UNMs, jumping in for some emergency backup tanking when somebody goes down or a situation gets out of hand (like Nilats' SR story), etc.

Also, I had a pretty big oversight in my previous post talking about katanas for MDT... I totally forgot Shigi also has DT-5% (along with the ninjutsu recast reduction I did remember to mention), so it's gonna be your offhand choice there over an NQ Raicho. Despite Shigi having enmity-10, which is obviously not ideal if you're trying to tank.

However, if you're trying to mitigate strong magical AoE as a tank, I'm guessing not a lot of others are in range anyway and you're looking more at something like a mage backline setup, which is a lot easier to hold hate on anyway versus strong melee DDs.
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 Asura.Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-21 05:28:52
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Hey everyone I just wanted to let you know I have mu lua up and running, thanks to everyone's Help and code shared. It by no means is finished, but for anyone looking for a basic/decent lua with a few bells and whistle go ahead and check it out. Most of it is taken from various already publicized luas, but I added a few things too.

You will see I have a bit of comments through out. Things I hope to code (or have someone else code), and some basic stats for the gear sets you can go by. I hope this helps someone, and if your capable of coding a few of my suggestions at the top of the lua, or can think of other useful ones, please share :D
Spoiler Alert! Click to view.

dont mind the gear, I plan to update that a lot and take out redundancies.
 Ragnarok.Flippant
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By Ragnarok.Flippant 2016-09-21 17:18:29
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I didn't write these with your file or each other in mind, so you will have to integrate the rules together. I also didn't load anything, so there are surely some syntax errors.

Quote:
-- Echo drops for when I am silenced AND try to use magic (not auto)
Code 
function job_precast(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
    if spell.action_type=="Magic" and buffactive.Silence then
        eventArgs.cancel = true
        send_command('input /item "Echo Drops" <me>')
    end
end

Quote:
-- Cure potency recieved+ auto activate when cure spell cast on me
This would require parsing packets or chat message (ideally the former), but would best be done in a separate addon that you could then use to send commands to GS.

Quote:
-- holy water gear change when item is used
Note that the last time I checked, GS only parses items if you use the command, not if you use it through the menu.
Code 
function job_precast(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
    if spell.english=="Holy Water" then
        --equip gear
    end
end

Quote:
-- March from trust cycle/toggle for haste values (currently all march are considered to be ghrn)
Can literally just copy and paste the same code for HasteMode. Like, "MarchMode." From there, I honestly think it'd be best at this point to just add all the buffs as numbers and decide what to wear based on that. For example:
Code 
local hastelvl = 0
if buffactive[33] then
    if state.HasteMode.value=='Hi' then
        hastelvl = hastelvl + 30
    else
        hastelvl = hastelvl + 15
    end
end
if buffactive[580] then
    hastelvl = hastelvl + 30
end
if buffactive.March then
    if buffactive.March==2 then
        if state.MarchMode.value=='NPC' then
            ...
        else
            ...
        end
    else
        ...
    end
end

if hastelvl > 35 then
    classes.CustomMeleeGroups:append('MaxHaste')
elseif
    ...

Quote:
-- reive neck auto locked in reive
Code 
function job_buff_change(buff,gain,buff_table)
    if buff:lower()=='Reive Mark' then
        if gain then 
            equip({neck="Ygnas's Resolve +1"}) disable('neck')
        else 
            enable('neck') 
        end
    end
end

Quote:
-- cp mantle lock when manually put on (not a toggle)
I set this up with the idea that you could handle other items in similar ways. You could handle the Reive thing this way too (using buffactive).
Code 
function job_precast(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
    lock_gear()
end

function job_handle_equipping_gear(status, eventArgs)
    lock_gear()
end

function lock_gear()
    if player.equipment.back=="Capacity Mantle" then
        disable('back')
    else
        enable('back')
    end
end

Quote:
-- Auto user set to equip when slept/terro/stunned/etc
You can use the buff_active() function (like the Reive thing) or the lock_gear() function above to do that (it's called by the handle_equipping_gear() inside your buff_change() function, so it will automatically be called when you get slept/terrored/stunned).

Quote:
-- town audolin idle set instead of generic town (garb)
Code 
function customize_idle_set(idleSet)
    if S{"Eastern Adoulin","Western Adoulin"}:contains(world.area) then
        idleSet = set_combine(idleSet,{body="something something"})
    end
end

Quote:
-- AM time warnings
I don't know what this means.

Quote:
-- ammo toggle disable for parties
I don't know what this means.

Quote:
-- That cool cor roll chat thing I see so many using
I don't know what this is referring to, but I imagine it's something that involves parsing packets or chat, which again is preferably the former and preferably separate from GS.

Quote:
-- alert when low on a nin tool
If you don't carry certain tools, you could just not put them in the ninjaTools array.
Code 
ninjaTools = {
        Utsusemi = S{"Shihei","Shikanofuda"},
        Hojo = S{"Kaginawa","Chonofuda"},
    }

function job_precast(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
    if spell.type=="Ninjutsu" then check_tools(spell) end
end

function check_tools(spell)
    for prefix,tools in pairs(ninjaTools) do
        if spell.english:startswith(prefix) then
            for tool in tools:it() do
                if not player.inventory[tool] then
                    add_to_chat(100,'WARNING: You are out of '..tool..'.')
                elseif player.inventory[tool].count < 10 then
                    add_to_chat(100,'WARNING: You are low on '..tool..'. '..player.inventory[tool].count..' remaining.')
                end
            end
        end
    end
end

Quote:
-- echo chat for elemental ninjitsu resist rates down
I don't know what this means, in a practical sense.
 Asura.Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-21 18:55:29
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you are my hero again today ;D will start adding them asap!
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-21 19:37:10
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Ragnarok.Flippant said: »
Quote:
-- town audolin idle set instead of generic town (garb)
Code 
function customize_idle_set(idleSet)
    if S{"Eastern Adoulin","Western Adoulin"}:contains(world.area) then
        idleSet = set_combine(idleSet,{body="something something"})
    end
end

I use this:
Code 
	if areas.Cities:contains(world.area) and world.area:contains("Adoulin") then
		idleSet = set_combine(idleSet, sets.adoulinmovement)
	elseif  world.area:contains("Mog Garden") then
		idleSet = set_combine(idleSet, sets.farmer)
        end

Ragnarok.Flippant said: »
Quote:
-- AM time warnings
I don't know what this means.

Something like
Code 
amset=0
function job_post_precast(spell, action, spellMap, eventArgs)
	if player.tp > 1000 and amset~=1 then
		if spell.english == "Blade: Metsu" then
			if player.tp < 2000 then
				send_command('wait 55;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			elseif player.tp < 3000 then
				send_command('wait 115;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			elseif player.tp == 3000 then
				send_command('wait 175;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			end
			amset=1
		elseif player.equipment.main == "Nagi" and spell.english=="Blade: Kamu" then
			if player.tp < 2000 then
				send_command('wait 85;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			elseif player.tp < 3000 then
				send_command('wait 115;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			elseif player.tp == 3000 then
				send_command('wait 175;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			end
			amset=1
		elseif player.equipment.main == "Kanagi" and spell.english=="Blade: Hi" then
			if player.tp < 2000 then
				send_command('wait 55;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			elseif player.tp < 3000 then
				send_command('wait 115;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			elseif player.tp == 3000 then
				send_command('wait 175;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			end
			amset=1
		elseif player.equipment.main == "Heishi Shorinken" and spell.english=="Blade: Shun" then
			send_command('wait 175;input /echo Aftermath wearing in 5 seconds;wait 5;gs c unsetam')
			amset=1
		end
	end
	if cmdParams[1] == "unsetam" then
		amset=0
	end
end


Though in game timers tell you how long and also make the buffs start blinking so I think that's better and this isn't necessary.

Here's my lua WIP, was doing decent tp to shun but everything else is disabled but the haste mode with dw calcs are all working:
http://pastebin.com/W7sGYVLM
 Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-09-21 20:40:21
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I did some additional recast time stuff here (https://www.bluegartr.com/threads/108196-Random-Facts-Thread-Magic/page5). Couldn't find it anywhere else.

If you have capped magic haste and are trying to floor Utsusemi recasts, you will need the following amount of Fast Cast.

Without Shigi

Ichi - 52
Ni - 58
San - 62

With Shigi

Ichi - 36
Ni - 48
San - 56

ItemSet 346432

This set has 61 Fast Cast but you likely shouldn't need all of it as Kanaria has 5 Fast Cast. If you aren't using Kanaria or Shigi you'll need a Weatherspoon Ring.
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 Ragnarok.Flippant
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By Ragnarok.Flippant 2016-09-21 21:10:01
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Wow. I actually thought he meant AM as in ante meridiem >_>;

If you use Timers plugin, you can make a custom timer, as well.
Code 
send_command('timers create AM3 180 down;')

I also think that buff_change is a more suitable for that, since using the above is liable to create false timers unless search for buffactive, which is just a lot of unnecessary code. The only concern would be relics (assuming they still all just say "Aftermath").

A general function for M/E/A for all jobs, not specific to Mote's.
Code 
function aftermath_timer(buff)
    local timer = nil
    buff = buff:lower()
    if buff:startswith('aftermath') then
        if buff=="aftermath lv.3" or (buff=="aftermath" and S{"Aeneas","Godhands","Sequence","Lionheart","Tri-edge","Chango","Anguta","Trishula","Heishi Shorinken","Dojikiri Yasutsuna","Tishtrya","Khatvanga","Fail-Not","Fomalhaut"}:contains(player.equipment.main)) then
            timer = 180
        elseif buff=="aftermath: lv.1" then
            if S{"Vajra","Glanzfaust","Conqueror","Yagrush","Laevateinn","Murgleis","Burtgang","Liberator","Aymur","Carnwenhan","Gastraphetes","Kogarasumaru","Nagi","Ryunohige","Nirvana","Tizona","Death Penalty","Kenkonken","Terpsichore","Tupismati","Idris","Epeolatry"}:contains(player.equipment.main) then
                if S{"Tizona","Kenkonken","Murgleis","Yagrush","Carnwenhan","Nirvana","Tupsimati"}:contains(player.equipment.main) then --abnormal timers
                    timer = 270
                else
                    timer = 90
                end
            else
                timer = 60
            end
        elseif buff=="aftermath: lv.2" then
            if S{"Tizona","Kenkonken","Murgleis","Yagrush","Carnwenhan","Nirvana","Tupsimati"}:contains(player.equipment.main) then --abnormal timers
                timer = 270
            else
                timer = 120
            end
        end
    end
    if timer then
        send_command('timers create AM '..timer..' down;')
    end
end

function buff_change(buff,gain)
    if buff:startswith('aftermath') and gain then 
        aftermath_timer(buff)
    end
end

(I don't actually know what's up with the unique timers and BG wiki is quite vague, so someone help me.)

Relics... The only way I can think of something satisfying is something like this (this one is specific to Mote's):
Code 
function job_precast(spell,action,spellMap,eventArgs)
    if data.weaponskills.relic[player.equipment.main] and data.weaponskills.relic[player.equipment.main==spell.english then
        relic_tp = player.tp
    end
end

function job_aftercast(spell,action,spellMap,eventArgs)
    if not spell.interrupted and data.weaponskills.relic[player.equipment.main] and data.weaponskills.relic[player.equipment.main==spell.english then
        if relic_tp < 2000 then relic_am = 'aftermath lv.1'
        elseif relic_tp < 3000 then relic_am = 'aftermath lv.2'
        else relic_am = 'aftermath lv.3' end
        aftermath_timer(relic_am)
    end
end


This would prevent false positives caused by WS not going off. However, I have no idea how overwriting works with Relic; in the rules, I'm assuming that a 60 second aftermath will overwrite a 120 second aftermath. If it behaves differently, depending on the particulars, I will come back and amend this.

(and also, Kannagi is mispelled)
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-21 21:57:49
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Thanks Flippant, for your posts above. I don't think there's really any reason to use it like I said if you turn on in game SE timers as it will blink the icon and have accurate timers anyway. Sorry about the Kannagi mispell, I wrote it quickly as a demo (though I did pass it through a parser). I can understand thinking it means AM time xD

Fenrir.Snaps said: »
If you have capped magic haste and are trying to floor Utsusemi recasts, you will need the following amount of Fast Cast.
Thanks for this post :D can I ask what you mean by floor though? I just wanna be sure I understand it.
 Fenrir.Snaps
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By Fenrir.Snaps 2016-09-21 22:20:38
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Verda said: »
Fenrir.Snaps said: »
If you have capped magic haste and are trying to floor Utsusemi recasts, you will need the following amount of Fast Cast.
Thanks for this post :D can I ask what you mean by floor though? I just wanna be sure I understand it.

I mean get the lowest possible non quick magic recasts, which are as follows

Utsusemi: Ichi - 6 seconds
Utsusemi: Ni - 9 seconds
Utsusemi: San - 12 seconds
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 Asura.Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-21 23:44:43
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snaps your awesome, ty ;D I need more fc for sure its a weak spot.

Verda your code works but throws errors for me, just a simple nil value but it was bothersome to see the red constantly lol. Honestly though I think your right, no need for it with timers, so scratching that off.

lua is getting pretty beefed up its nice ;D
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 09:04:47
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Even without switching to a mab set and just using a base ws set my blade: chi is doing huge damage in reisenjima, sometimes about 4k more than my Shun. Is this a hybrid class WS or something? If so it could have a lot of potential if anyone has figured out how to make it work.

Here's some of my logs from last night messing around:
Code 
[20:29:21][Verda] 13244 Blade: Chi ¨ Lucani
[20:29:21][Verda] 13244 Blade: Chi ¨ Lucani
[20:28:14][Verda] 10154 Blade: Chi ¨ Glowering Ladybug
[20:27:28][Verda] 12627 Blade: Chi ¨ Agitated Chapuli


While I have done a 16k shun to a slashing weak mob, idk, this was averaging higher than me for some reason and I didn't even have a set for it...

Tried again it's using this gear:
Code 
	    head=ah_head,
	    neck="Fotia Gorget",
	    left_ear=moonshade,
	    right_ear="Ishvara earring",
        left_ring="Epona's Ring",
        right_ring="Apate Ring",
	    body="Abnoba Kaftan",
		hands=hercgloves_acc,
		waist="Fotia Belt",
        legs="Hiza. Hizayoroi +1",
		feet=hercboots_acc,
		back=andartia


I tried a strict mab set and it made it do less damage..
I do dip lower dmg like 6k-7k a lot, maybe these higher ones are when the first hit crits?

Edit: Ok only changes I made were to summon the stary sibyl and use the seething bomblet. Ws'd around 1500 TP:

They aren't all this large but... does anyone know how to optimize it? Seems to work a bit like flaming crush.
 eliroo
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By eliroo 2016-09-22 10:00:33
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Verda said: »
They aren't all this large but... does anyone know how to optimize it? Seems to work a bit like flaming crush.


Did you try BP Damage + with it?

Joking aside, I have no idea and no current way to test it.
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 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 10:08:18
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eliroo said: »
Verda said: »
They aren't all this large but... does anyone know how to optimize it? Seems to work a bit like flaming crush.


Did you try BP Damage + with it?

Joking aside, I have no idea and no current way to test it.

:P I guess I could put on varar rings xD but ya no.

new bestest solo result:
If no one has any answer I guess I'll just keep messing around till I figure it out more over time.
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 Asura.Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-22 11:19:15
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Oh wow this could be really interesting for sure. And I have no idea haha, but more power to you! doing 20k on nin even on fodder mobs is a very hard thing to do. I normally can only push 20k with 300tp ten, and my ten set is pretty top class.

Are you doing all of these at 1500tp?
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 11:51:10
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Ya almost all of them are lower tp values, though boosted 500 TP with aeonic and another 250 with moonshade. And ya blade: ten is fun :D
 Asura.Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-22 12:12:00
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Oh ya true :d so your really wsing at 2250 tp :D still great numbers even for that amount. Its always been listed at str/int. I am unsure of any other stats, but apparently there is something impacting it, I will test a bit tonight if I have time, dont get home until late.
 eliroo
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By eliroo 2016-09-22 12:27:22
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Are those numbers with a support of any kind? If you are doing 20k with no Malaise, I wonder how much higher the damage will be with Malaise.
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 12:28:42
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My current theory which will most likely later be proven wrong is that the first hit is used as base damage for the magical portion, and that additional hits in the physical swing each add 1 fTP because that's how most WS work. I also think the first hit can critical. If I get a mob low hp and use Chi it will take 1500 to 5k damage. I think that number is then used as the base and multiplied again by mab, with perhaps wsmods added in a 2nd time. Multi hits and crits landing or not would also help explain some of the fluctuations.

eliroo said: »
Are those numbers with a support of any kind? If you are doing 20k with no Malaise, I wonder how much higher the damage will be with Malaise.
Yah just trusts, not even star sibyl in the 21k one. Had cor trust for chaos + fighter's, and haste from ulmia and koru-moru, shell/protect from apu etc. I can't remember if berserk was active or not but was WAR sub. And ya with malaise and frailty both I'd estimate doing 2-3x more damage.
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By eliroo 2016-09-22 12:39:32
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Unfortunately its SC properties are pretty terrible for solo purposes. With a SCH setting up Liquefaction you can probably make a pretty nice Fusion with it though which can close light with Metsu or Kamu.
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 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 12:44:43
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True :D I thought maybe you could solo six step rotating Ei and Chi. It's fun to mess around with stuff lol
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By Asura.Avallon 2016-09-22 12:54:10
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Verda said: »
True :D I thought maybe you could solo six step rotating Ei and Chi. It's fun to mess around with stuff lol

I see you made Heishi - congrats! I'm working on that particular one as we speak and am looking forward to playing around with it. Have you tested any self-SC's with bursting yet?
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 13:00:50
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Thanks :D And early congrats to you. I haven't setup my bursting set yet D: but that is next on my to do list after I get some of the AF pieces.
 Asura.Avallon
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By Asura.Avallon 2016-09-22 13:04:48
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Verda said: »
Thanks :D And early congrats to you. I haven't setup my bursting set yet D: but that is next on my to do list after I get some of the AF pieces.

I know that Ochu's are most likely better weapons to focus on bursting but I'm curious to see what Heishi will do as well. I'm hearing of some ridiculous bursting numbers from NIN's who have taken the time to build a proper MAB/Bursting set.
 eliroo
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By eliroo 2016-09-22 13:07:09
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What do your numbers look like with Ei? Pixie Hairpin, Archon ring and decent MAB set could easily make that WS look really good, Chi > Ei may be extremely viable when the mob has malaise on it.

Then again, bursting both Trans and Compression is impossible for Ninja.
 Verda
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By Verda 2016-09-22 14:02:45
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Asura.Avallon said: »
I know that Ochu's are most likely better weapons to focus on bursting but I'm curious to see what Heishi will do as well. I'm hearing of some ridiculous bursting numbers from NIN's who have taken the time to build a proper MAB/Bursting set.

Nice :D Yah it will take me some time to gear up everything but looking forward to it. I have a few ochu too.

eliroo said: »
What do your numbers look like with Ei? Pixie Hairpin, Archon ring and decent MAB set could easily make that WS look really good, Chi > Ei may be extremely viable when the mob has malaise on it.

Then again, bursting both Trans and Compression is impossible for Ninja.
WIP, but you're right that is a big downside to doing that chain xD
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 Asura.Azagarth
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Game: FFXI
user: Azagarth
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By Asura.Azagarth 2016-09-23 08:02:51
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I could not even get close to your posted chi numbers, I was doing domain invasion, avg of 8k metsu but 2.5k chi.
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