The Beast Within -- A Guide To Blue Mage

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The Beast Within -- A Guide to Blue Mage
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By lhova 2016-03-08 08:36:19
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Ok quick Colada questions! I recently got 2 swords and I've already started augmenting them. When I used the DM campaign the augs were kinda meh but I did get +12 dam, 2 or 3 DA (can't remember) and 17 Acc and a 5 Att on one of them. The other Colada I got +12 Dam, 18 Acc and Att and +9 Str. I already had Nibiru and Tan +1 so my question is what are the minimum augs for Colada required to retire my Tan +1/Nibiru or instead of Colada/Colada should I use one of my current Colada's with the Tan +1. I figured the Nibiru is retire regardless. Also if I'm looking to get "dream" augs on COlada's is that going to require a Taupe spam? Thank you!
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By Asura.Brennski 2016-03-08 08:53:54
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I would use Tan+1 in the Main hand and the Colada with +12 dam, 2 or 3 DA (can't remember) and 17 Acc and a 5 Att in the Off hand. The Crit Hit Rate, Crit hit damage and High Damage on Tan+1 is really useful for CDC.
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By Boshi 2016-03-08 09:21:53
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I wouldn't waste dark matter augs on a weapon unless you're like a non-melee mage hoping for phalanx+
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By lhova 2016-03-08 09:25:27
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Asura.Brennski said: »
I would use Tan+1 in the Main hand and the Colada with +12 dam, 2 or 3 DA (can't remember) and 17 Acc and a 5 Att in the Off hand. The Crit Hit Rate, Crit hit damage and High Damage on Tan+1 is really useful for CDC.

I only ask because the "dream" tier (excluding Tizona/Almace) is 2 Colada's at +20 Dam, +15 Dex, 15 Acc/Att and some DA or Crit Dam. Wasn't sure if you needed the absolute max to replace Tan +1. I'm also hoping to replace my Vamp's with these Colada's (Since my Vamps are far from max auged) but I see that Colada doesn't have the Int that Vamps can have. Not sure if the extra Mag Dam on Colada's negate the Int on Vamp's for magic cleave.
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By Sylph.Parshias 2016-03-08 09:26:53
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lhova said: »
Ok quick Colada questions! I recently got 2 swords and I've already started augmenting them. When I used the DM campaign the augs were kinda meh but I did get +12 dam, 2 or 3 DA (can't remember) and 17 Acc and a 5 Att on one of them. The other Colada I got +12 Dam, 18 Acc and Att and +9 Str. I already had Nibiru and Tan +1 so my question is what are the minimum augs for Colada required to retire my Tan +1/Nibiru or instead of Colada/Colada should I use one of my current Colada's with the Tan +1. I figured the Nibiru is retire regardless. Also if I'm looking to get "dream" augs on COlada's is that going to require a Taupe spam? Thank you!

From my experience toying around in the BLU DPS spreadsheet, you need a ridiculous augment on a Colada to beat out current options.

For example my current off-hand Colada is DMG+13 DEX+14 Acc+12 Att+8 STP+2. (I might have misremembered the Acc/Att) The spreadsheet lists this option as being about even with Nibiru B, although I assume it would pull ahead if we could compare to something that isn't Tojil, as it has an accuracy advantage.

My un-scientific conclusion from messing around in the spreadsheet with Colada augs is that if your sword doesn't have DEX on it, don't use it.
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By lhova 2016-03-08 09:27:45
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Boshi said: »
I wouldn't waste dark matter augs on a weapon unless you're like a non-melee mage hoping for phalanx+

Oh ok, so dark matter shouldn't be used on weapons, ok. I was hoping that the dark matter could get me to the dream augments. Also would Taupe stones be the ones to use to get the "dream" augs, considering that you would want 15 Dex and you can't get it without Taupe (the way I'm reading the guide that's my assumption).
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By Takisan 2016-03-08 09:30:41
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Fenrir.Nightfyre said: »
Playing with the BLU spreadsheet a bit today, some quick numbers:

-Tizona/Almace and Almace/Sequence are incredibly close with AM3 up on both. Almace actually comes out slightly ahead on the spreadsheet right now, but Tizona's superior WS frequency and higher average WS damage offers the possibility of more and bigger skillchains.

-AM3 Tizona/Almace vs AM1 Almace/Sequence favors Tizona by about 3%, but if you incorporate the rebuilding phase for AM3 then DPS is roughly comparable before taking skillchains into account.

-Offhand Sequence only beats a very well augmented Colada by about 1%. TP Bonus not working in the offhand is really quite unfortunate, and it's otherwise ill suited to the offhand position.

-Sequence/Colada is about 3% ahead of Colada/Colada for CDC spam, and more than 10% behind Tizona/Almace. Sequence/Almace is ~7% behind Tizona/Almace. This is before considering aftermath and Radiance/Umbra skillchains. While TPB+500 provides a substantial boost to Savage Blade and Expiacion, you're still stuck using Requiescat at least once if you want to utilize the aftermath. If you're solo then you're either looking at using it again (ex Savage->Expi/CDC->Req->Req) to close Umbra or using CA Thrashing Assault en route to Radiance (Req->Savage->Thrashing->CDC), both of which are substantial losses. Even with a very strong Requiescat set (STR/att/TA Herc, HQ Carmine body, etc), I'm struggling to envision this as a net gain under perfect conditions, let alone if anything messes up the skillchain. Thrashing Assault also increases the risk of dropping the skillchain prematurely since it returns no TP and incurs an extra second of forced inaction. The situations in which mainhand Sequence is the best mainhand for a BLU strike me as very few and far between at best, even in party situations. Trying to take full advantage of the aftermath and our better weaponskills at the same time is simply too awkward to realize its full potential.


Probably an odd question. Since I have afterglow almace and afterglow tizona if ever maintaining Tizona AM3 wasn't viable would Almace/Nibru be better than Almace/tizona?
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By Cerberus.Jeffil 2016-03-08 09:41:15
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lhova said: »
Boshi said: »
I wouldn't waste dark matter augs on a weapon unless you're like a non-melee mage hoping for phalanx+

Oh ok, so dark matter shouldn't be used on weapons, ok. I was hoping that the dark matter could get me to the dream augments. Also would Taupe stones be the ones to use to get the "dream" augs, considering that you would want 15 Dex and you can't get it without Taupe (the way I'm reading the guide that's my assumption).

Taupe stones force a stat roll and either increase the cap to 15, or add 5 to the roll (I haven't done a taupe augment in a while so which one escapes me at the moment).

With this week's unity campaign, I think I should focus on getting a Tanmogayi. I read on the BG wiki that BLU/RUN x2 (imagining using fire resist runes and 2x wards), GEO, COR, and WHM makes for a fast and efficient kill. Any input or verification on this?
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By Bismarck.Squah 2016-03-08 09:54:20
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Cerberus.Jeffil said: »
With this week's unity campaign, I think I should focus on getting a Tanmogayi. I read on the BG wiki that BLU/RUN x2 (imagining using fire resist runes and 2x wards), GEO, COR, and WHM makes for a fast and efficient kill. Any input or verification on this?

Pretty much. Vex/Attunement, barfire and Unda makes the damage trivial, but paralyze from Ululation might land. He'll howl, start with Ululation and then spam GoH several times, and then finish the cycle with a hoplon. We proc'd him a couple times while spamming CDC but couldn't really figure out what caused it. Add another Geo for Frailty and wtfever and it dies faster. 1150~ acc before buffs should cap (I don't really remember this. I think I had 1020acc before food cause my gear was bad, but with sublime my acc was alright)
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 Asura.Isiolia
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By Asura.Isiolia 2016-03-08 10:10:52
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lhova said: »
I'm also hoping to replace my Vamp's with these Colada's (Since my Vamps are far from max auged) but I see that Colada doesn't have the Int that Vamps can have. Not sure if the extra Mag Dam on Colada's negate the Int on Vamp's for magic cleave.

I think for most things the INT will do more. Far as I know, the basic way to look at +Magic Damage is like a 1.0 INT multiplier, and I think even Subduction has a 2.0 there. Not sure if BLU has any spells we regularly use that'd favor +Magic Damage over INT/etc on a per-point basis.

'course, if you're cleaving with Vampirisms, then you're already making a damage tradeoff relative to Nibiru Cudgels or whatnot. Personally, I like them for stuff like NNI or Salvage. Depending on what you're relying on them for, perhaps there's some other combination of augments that'd make it worth it (TH+ or something).
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2016-03-08 11:15:30
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There are only two post-75 nukes with a non-2.0 dINT multiplier, namely Water Bomb (1.5) and Gates of Hades (1.0). It's pretty safe to assume that 1 INT yields 2 base damage for your nukes sans Magic Hammer (dMND), or more if INT contributes to WSC.

You could always try for an INT aug on a magic path Colada alongside macc/mab. You need really good augments to beat a pair of cudgels though.

Takisan said: »
Probably an odd question. Since I have afterglow almace and afterglow tizona if ever maintaining Tizona AM3 wasn't viable would Almace/Nibru be better than Almace/tizona?
Actually, yes. Path B has a modest lead (~3%) if hitrate's capped and pDIF isn't; path A is a slight net gain in hitrate (and obviously helps Almace too) over Tizona III if acc is an issue. If hitrate and pDIF are capped then both options are a ~1% lead over offhand Tizona.
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By lhova 2016-03-08 12:58:11
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Asura.Isiolia said: »
lhova said: »
I'm also hoping to replace my Vamp's with these Colada's (Since my Vamps are far from max auged) but I see that Colada doesn't have the Int that Vamps can have. Not sure if the extra Mag Dam on Colada's negate the Int on Vamp's for magic cleave.

I think for most things the INT will do more. Far as I know, the basic way to look at +Magic Damage is like a 1.0 INT multiplier, and I think even Subduction has a 2.0 there. Not sure if BLU has any spells we regularly use that'd favor +Magic Damage over INT/etc on a per-point basis.

'course, if you're cleaving with Vampirisms, then you're already making a damage tradeoff relative to Nibiru Cudgels or whatnot. Personally, I like them for stuff like NNI or Salvage. Depending on what you're relying on them for, perhaps there's some other combination of augments that'd make it worth it (TH+ or something).

Yeah I'm referring to Salvage farms where I use Vamps. Was hoping that Colada's melee path could be enough for my BR@ spams on the gears. I have Nib Cudgels but I don't ever use them in Salvage.
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By KnifeKatRengar 2016-03-08 20:13:26
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I am trying to get the +2 Refresh augment with the Dark Matters Campaign, and ended up with this on Herc Hands:

+14 STR +14 Acc, +17 Attac, Macc+20, MAB+20.

Any reason to keep these augments over the +2 refresh IF I can get it? Or keep these hands, and farm another tonight before the Dark Matter Augments /recast in the morning?
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By Sylph.Oraen 2016-03-08 20:16:09
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Really no reason to keep those. We've got better nuking hands.
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By KnifeKatRengar 2016-03-08 20:18:28
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I was leaning more towards S. Blade.

I didn't see S.Blade Gearset in the main OP. So trying to put together a WS set for it as well.
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By Sylph.Oraen 2016-03-08 20:20:03
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We also have better Sanguine hands.
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By KnifeKatRengar 2016-03-08 20:20:40
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Alright. I thought I might of had something neat. :( Guess not...lol
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By Sylph.Oraen 2016-03-08 20:22:34
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It might work if you have other light armor jobs that need magical pieces, such as COR or NIN, but I'm pretty sure they also get better. The dark matter campaign is just a plethora of disappointment, don't feel too bad.
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2016-03-08 20:47:03
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INT is far, far more important to Sanguine Blade than STR, and no base MAB makes +20 pretty mediocre when things like Amalric exist. As far as actually gearing SB, can more or less treat it like Tenebral Crush. Identical dINT terms, dark elemental (Pixie Hairpin +1 and Archon Ring are your friends), only real difference is WSC/fTP (50% MND 30% STR 2.75 fTP vs 30% INT 30% MND 30% VIT 4.0 fTP). Our nuking options are pretty straightforward these days (can't wear Merlinic so 4/5 Amalric + Herc head is a given, other slots generally have certain items that are clearly BIS), so nothing actually changes gearwise.

As far as the DM campaign, it's really a case of targeting single augments that are useful on their own (refresh, TH, etc) and maybe getting lucky along the way. I've picked up a few other useful augments along the way between myself and my alt, but they're just lucky bonuses. At least right now it's free, I can't imagine spamming dark matter for augments outside the campaign. Such a ridiculous system.
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By Sylph.Oraen 2016-03-08 20:55:45
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Yeah, I will give it that. I'd be far more upset if I was paying for each augment. I've got a few utility pieces on my main during the campaign, so I probably shouldn't complain.
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By Asura.Brennski 2016-03-09 04:02:09
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Apart from with Tizona and high Acc Situations when is Lupine Cape better then Bleating Mantle for TP?
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By Asura.Calatilla 2016-03-09 05:21:09
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Would 2% weaponskill damage on sanguine blade beat a MaB earring?

ishvara earring vs friomisi earring or crematio earring
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By lhova 2016-03-09 06:57:28
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Think I can finally retire Nibiru in my offhand. Got a colada with +15 dmg, 15 dex, 17 Acc, 18 Att and 2% critical hit rate. Figured I'd pair it with my Tan +1. My other Colada has 12 dmg, 18 Acc, 19 Att 13 Dex and -3 pdt but I figured it's not enough to dual Coladas on Blu.
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By Asura.Arnan 2016-03-09 15:52:23
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Well hello there set bonus



Made loads of upgrades to my BLU lua if anyone interested http://pastebin.com/X5yzZYB2
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By Siren.Kyte 2016-03-09 16:22:32
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This may or may not apply to you, but personally I almost never lunge unless I'm using it for an MB- so if you decide you're too lazy to add an additional toggle for that, you could just make your default an MB set.
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By KnifeKatRengar 2016-03-09 23:04:07
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Bismarck.Squah said: »
Cerberus.Jeffil said: »
With this week's unity campaign, I think I should focus on getting a Tanmogayi. I read on the BG wiki that BLU/RUN x2 (imagining using fire resist runes and 2x wards), GEO, COR, and WHM makes for a fast and efficient kill. Any input or verification on this?

Pretty much. Vex/Attunement, barfire and Unda makes the damage trivial, but paralyze from Ululation might land. He'll howl, start with Ululation and then spam GoH several times, and then finish the cycle with a hoplon. We proc'd him a couple times while spamming CDC but couldn't really figure out what caused it. Add another Geo for Frailty and wtfever and it dies faster. 1150~ acc before buffs should cap (I don't really remember this. I think I had 1020acc before food cause my gear was bad, but with sublime my acc was alright)
iirc They mentioned Wanted 3 does not get the bonus coffers for those particular UNMs.

Fenrir.Nightfyre said: »
INT is far, far more important to Sanguine Blade than STR, and no base MAB makes +20 pretty mediocre when things like Amalric exist. As far as actually gearing SB, can more or less treat it like Tenebral Crush. Identical dINT terms, dark elemental (Pixie Hairpin +1 and Archon Ring are your friends), only real difference is WSC/fTP (50% MND 30% STR 2.75 fTP vs 30% INT 30% MND 30% VIT 4.0 fTP). Our nuking options are pretty straightforward these days (can't wear Merlinic so 4/5 Amalric + Herc head is a given, other slots generally have certain items that are clearly BIS), so nothing actually changes gearwise.

As far as the DM campaign, it's really a case of targeting single augments that are useful on their own (refresh, TH, etc) and maybe getting lucky along the way. I've picked up a few other useful augments along the way between myself and my alt, but they're just lucky bonuses. At least right now it's free, I can't imagine spamming dark matter for augments outside the campaign. Such a ridiculous system.

And alright, thank you. ^^
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By Fenrir.Tarowyn 2016-03-09 23:17:16
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KnifeKatRengar said: »
Bismarck.Squah said: »
Cerberus.Jeffil said: »
With this week's unity campaign, I think I should focus on getting a Tanmogayi. I read on the BG wiki that BLU/RUN x2 (imagining using fire resist runes and 2x wards), GEO, COR, and WHM makes for a fast and efficient kill. Any input or verification on this?

Pretty much. Vex/Attunement, barfire and Unda makes the damage trivial, but paralyze from Ululation might land. He'll howl, start with Ululation and then spam GoH several times, and then finish the cycle with a hoplon. We proc'd him a couple times while spamming CDC but couldn't really figure out what caused it. Add another Geo for Frailty and wtfever and it dies faster. 1150~ acc before buffs should cap (I don't really remember this. I think I had 1020acc before food cause my gear was bad, but with sublime my acc was alright)
iirc They mentioned Wanted 3 does not get the bonus coffers for those particular UNMs.

JP and US sites differ on that point (JP says Wanted 3 is included) but last time we had this campaign, 3 worked since I actually did Sarama and got 2 boxes per.
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By KnifeKatRengar 2016-03-10 00:03:02
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Fenrir.Tarowyn said: »
KnifeKatRengar said: »
Bismarck.Squah said: »
Cerberus.Jeffil said: »
With this week's unity campaign, I think I should focus on getting a Tanmogayi. I read on the BG wiki that BLU/RUN x2 (imagining using fire resist runes and 2x wards), GEO, COR, and WHM makes for a fast and efficient kill. Any input or verification on this?

Pretty much. Vex/Attunement, barfire and Unda makes the damage trivial, but paralyze from Ululation might land. He'll howl, start with Ululation and then spam GoH several times, and then finish the cycle with a hoplon. We proc'd him a couple times while spamming CDC but couldn't really figure out what caused it. Add another Geo for Frailty and wtfever and it dies faster. 1150~ acc before buffs should cap (I don't really remember this. I think I had 1020acc before food cause my gear was bad, but with sublime my acc was alright)
iirc They mentioned Wanted 3 does not get the bonus coffers for those particular UNMs.

JP and US sites differ on that point (JP says Wanted 3 is included) but last time we had this campaign, 3 worked since I actually did Sarama and got 2 boxes per.

Beautiful, so you're saying it does work, then? That would be great, to get me my Sword finally.
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By Fenrir.Nightfyre 2016-03-10 09:42:14
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Sword delays for post-Escha weaponry:

288 - NQ Tanmogayi
280 - HQ Tanmogayi
240 - Sequence, Colada, Iris, Vampirism
236 - Tizona, Nibiru Blade
224 - Almace

Adding 1% DW doesn't always result in loss in TP/hit due to flooring in TP calculations. Looking at 36 vs 37 DW (11/12% gear) in typical combinations:

288/240: no effect
288/236: no effect
280/240: no effect
280/236: reduces TP/hit
240/240: reduces TP/hit
240/236: reduces TP/hit
236/240: reduces TP/hit
236/236: no effect
236/224: reduces TP/hit
224/240: no effect
224/236: reduces TP/hit

Potentially worth bearing in mind when deciding what DW pieces to use. For instance, this opens up pairing Reiki Yotai and a 5% DW piece for any of the above combinations where TP/hit doesn't suffer. That means you could use Suppa instead of Eabani, or more likely Adhemar Jacket and Cessance Earring (~equivalent to Suppa/Reiki/4% TA Herc depending on other augs; STR+10 and high attack tends toward a very slight lead).

There's a few such nuances in our gearing options. Bleating vs Lupine is another, particularly under Tizona AM3; which is better may vary based on Lupine's effect on your TP/hit and attack rounds/WS.
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By Phoenix.Capuchin 2016-03-10 19:15:28
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While the weapon delay info above is great information, I'd also caution not to get too caught up in the theoretical perfect world of a spreadsheet when thinking about excess DW.

In the real world, in many cases you won't WS instantly when you have TP - any time you might have to coordinate SCs (i.e. if you aren't the sole DD using WS/solo SC), amnesia, some sort of physical shield move, etc. So, TP overflow affects the generally "ideal" scenario of WSing whenever possible (extra TP does contribute to WS damage, but still isn't as good as always being able to WS ASAP).

And even in ideal situations where you can always WS instantly, the TP/hit loss is very small and may be insignificant. Obviously you don't want to use unnecessary DW for no reason, but if you're analyzing something like the Suppa/Eabani comparison (if for whatever reason you need any DW from earrings), it's highly likely that for all practical purposes the extra sword skill+5 on Suppa outweighs the rather small negative impact of 1 point of excess DW. Or for the Adhemar Jacket/Reiki belt DW+12 combo - assuming that puts you 1 DW over capped delay - in deciding whether that combo beats whatever alternative you're considering, 1 point of excess DW is highly unlikely to be a big enough negative to make any difference in the outcome of that comparison even if it DOES cause a TP/hit reduction.
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