Situational Replacement For Kamome?

Oneiros Knife: 30Dmg delay:150 AGI+6 increases critical hit damage(10%)

This looks like a sexy offhand option for Kannagi in capped acc situations. scars/visions zones?

Things to consider 30 less delay, significantly less, more aftermath procs and more swinging in general. Losing out on 8 attack and 8 accuracy as well as the difference in attack and acc from the skill difference? You won't lose the mainhand acc/attack so that wont change but in terms of DoT will this significantly lessen offhand DMG with the low DMG and lessened attack

Peoples thoughts:

Seeing as the dagger has less DPS than the katana, not the mention how powerful a stat that attack is inside abyssea, I'd say *** your dagger.

Twilight Knife / Kamome puts out more damage than Hocho / Kamome in most every parse I recorded. If you have better Katanas then your results may vary, but for the general population it is a viable option.

Hardly, seeing as everything on that dagger is worse than you'd find on Kamome.

I wasn't calling him out or nothing, just saying, *** the dagger. Wasn't saying "*** tard for thinking of that." Was more along the lines of "*** that dagger." Like, "hey you wanna go get pizza?" "*** that, I want a burger."

Do we have a sort of "Nightfyre-symbol" to display on the cloudy night sky yet?

In progress.

You're also losing 9 damage points on the offhand hit. I just don't see any situation it would do better.

Maybe the lower delay + fighting something that is weak against peircing? idk

My friend Dan did a bunch of calculations and had Kamome/Twilight beating all non-magian Katana/Kamome. Not sure if he used oirandori or not, though.

Spreadsheet comes out saying it's 5.5% better than hocho/kamome only having twilight with 3% TA (not QA) and not counting add effects.

Edit: Putting in better gear makes it about 5% better.

This brings up a question I had. Does the attack for your offhand weapon change if it's different from your main-hand? Accuracy does, so I assume attack would, but I don't know.

Also, I was hasty in my other calcs. One sec.

K, it depends on your acc and pdif. I need to know about the question I had earlier, but if your acc doesn't suffer much from the 39 skill gap (full merits, for instance, brings it to 23, which is 20 acc), it should be better. Same thing with attack.

Edit: Again assuming 3% TA and no add effects, not sure how to change the spreadsheet to hold QA.

Because pDIF and hitrate cap. If you're capped either way, further attack/accuracy won't help.

Yes, but if you're using Motenten's spreadsheet it's not set up to handle that.

Assuming capped accuracy (worth noting, there's a 43 acc difference between Kamome and Oneiros in the offhand), Oneiros wins by a small margin (~2% or less) in high pDIF situations. If you're not capping pDIF with Berserk up, you should probably stick to Kamome.

Thought so, set it up so the weapon has -atk and acc when using dagger.

Ty Night.

Nice to see it took 15 posts to see a serious answer to my question/proposition. Thank you.

To everyone else, go back to grade school and stop failing at reading comprehension. The consideration was meant for Blade: Hi, not that it wouldn't be viable for other ws but aftermath + AGI modifier makes it just too obvious..

And to all you who don't think reducing your base delay by 7.7% isn't significant Here is your new home


I need to find myself a 30 base damage katana / Did we have a conclusion on whether or not offhand attack is calculated separately? If accuracy isn't an issue and offhand attack isn't effected it should blow kamome out of the water, if it is I could see it being closer from a pure DD standpoint.

Think Chainmail+1 vs. Ningi+2

Kannagi/O.Knife vs. Kannagi/Kamome
in TP phase it would be:

7.7% less base delay
vs
(Eek just thought of the overall skill loss)
8 attack and 60 skill worst case scenario (354+16+5 & no dagger merits)

WS

6AGI
vs
8attack

Nobody said reduced delay wasn't good, the offhand attack will be affected by lower skill.

....Really? Maybe I misinterpreted. Or did I miss the memo where everything no longer included delay?

Having the mindset of "Ninja should always use katana/katana, no exceptions" is very shortsighted and ignorant. You should consider the possibilities offered by other weapon types in specific scenarios. As Night pointed out, the knife IS better than Kamome in certain scenarios, rendering your belief of "katana/katana is always best" incorrect.

As soon as I saw this knife back in the update .dat mine thread, I thought of its possible use with a Kannagi. Very few (if any) took me seriously on that thought. Glad to see others are looking into it now.

Forgive me for being blunt however at this point your track record isn't all that great...

Mindless swearing, denial and being close mindedness, more denial, circular logic, denial and repetitiveness.

I just can't see how people might see that as being ignorant and shortsighted...(Sarcasm because I'm not sure that you pick that up)

Thanks for your input, it's no longer necessary.

Kirana, do you know of a spreadsheet that can calculate offhand attack and accuracy separately?