Haste Is NOT Exponential...
Haste is NOT exponential...
You know what I find fascinating... the fact that you're all arguing and getting all bent out of shape over this ***. GTFO out of your mother's basement and get some physical activity. FFS..... who cares what it does.. just stack the god damn haste, attack faster, and move on.
[+]
Speaking of Relics, why is it that no one with a Guttler wears it? Even as town gear.
afk beating my *** for physical activity purposes
[+]
1/(200/600) is 600/200 simplified yes. But iirc the OP was putting 200/600 to explain their answer, so Tiger explained if you want to use 200/600, then you need to make it 1/(200/600) to be mathmatically correct.
Edit: Obv the exact numbers used were different, just speaking in terms of logic. What 200 represents and what 600 represents.
Edit: Obv the exact numbers used were different, just speaking in terms of logic. What 200 represents and what 600 represents.
Asura.Barthalomew said:
You know what I find fascinating... the fact that you're all arguing and getting all bent out of shape over this ***. GTFO out of your mother's basement and get some physical activity. FFS..... who cares what it does.. just stack the god damn haste, attack faster, and move on.
You're the only one getting bent outta shape over this, you red flag commie :P
The rest of us are having fun in our own usual ways.
[+]
Asura.Barthalomew said:
You know what I find fascinating... the fact that you're all arguing and getting all bent out of shape over this ***. GTFO out of your mother's basement and get some physical activity. FFS..... who cares what it does.. just stack the god damn haste, attack faster, and move on.
I imagine a lot of them are at work, and have nothing better to do like me XD
I think it's a stupid topic but I've argued over stupid crap before too, more so even out of boredom.
[+]
Asura.Dajociont said:
afk beating my *** for physical activity purposes
lol! Fapping doesn't count.. unless it's outside and you have to run from the police for indecent exposure... then it's definitly physical activity... >_>
Leviathan.Duvessa said:
Quote:
Graph the damage per hour and you'll notice it's not linear meaning the gains are exponential :P
As stated by the OP and others, this isn't a discussing of damage returns, but strictly the rate of attacks.
I'll do this one more time, pay attention, please.
We'll look at the effect of a 20% haste difference in two places.
0% haste vs 20% haste
40% haste vs 60% haste.
1000 delay 0% haste = 1000 delay
1000 delay 20% haste = 800 delay
1000 delay 40% haste = 600 delay
1000 delay 60% haste = 400 delay
We'll use 24,000 units of delay as the time frame, since it's divisible by all our respective delays.
24,000/1000 (0% haste) = 24 attacks
24,000/800 (20% haste) = 30 attacks
24,000/600 (40% haste) = 40 attacks
24,000/400 (60% haste) = 60 attacks.
If haste were linear, you'd get the same percent increase when you go from 0 to 20, from 20 to 40, and from 40 to 60% haste.
0 to 20% haste
30/24 = 25% increase in number of attacks
20 to 40% haste
40/30 = 33.33% increase in number of attacks.
40 to 60% haste
60/40 = 50% increase in number of attacks.
If it were linear, as you claim, then each increment of 20% haste would be the exact same increase, which it is not.
[+]
Asura.Barthalomew said:
You know what I find fascinating... the fact that you're all arguing and getting all bent out of shape over this ***. GTFO out of your mother's basement and get some physical activity. FFS..... who cares what it does.. just stack the god damn haste, attack faster, and move on.
RL card
GTFO the forums if you don't like it you semen stain.
[+]
Phoenix.Kojo said:
Speaking of Relics, why is it that no one with a Guttler wears it? Even as town gear.
Asura.Barthalomew said:
Asura.Dajociont said:
afk beating my *** for physical activity purposes
lol! Fapping doesn't count.. unless it's outside and you have to run from the police for indecent exposure... then it's definitly physical activity... >_>
I usually do jumping jacks while rotating between hands every time I land after jumping. Pretty healthy, you don't stop jumping until you're finished. So, lot of jumping, lot of fapping, very little dignity.
[+]
OPs arguement is:
600 delay (.10 haste) = 540 delay
600 delay (.20 haste) = 480 delay
600 delay (.30 haste) = 420 delay
*edit* and so on and so forth till 1.00 haste
My 10 year old nephew could tell you that...
600 delay (.10 haste) = 540 delay
600 delay (.20 haste) = 480 delay
600 delay (.30 haste) = 420 delay
*edit* and so on and so forth till 1.00 haste
My 10 year old nephew could tell you that...
[+]
Quote:
It effects delay by a straight percentage. Your swings (delay) is only directly affected by a straight percentage. Haste's effect is a straight, linear return. You are saying that Haste's effect is exponential, which means that adding 1% haste would lower your delay by greater than the previous addition to haste. That is what you are implying.
But then again, you also implied Delay lowering by a set amount, meaning adding 1% haste lowers the delay at the same amount as the previous addition which is linear.
That is what people are saying. Haste is not exponential. But your return (damage over time) is, thanks to the change in your delay.
But then again, you also implied Delay lowering by a set amount, meaning adding 1% haste lowers the delay at the same amount as the previous addition which is linear.
That is what people are saying. Haste is not exponential. But your return (damage over time) is, thanks to the change in your delay.
No, OP is claiming the returns to be linear. And also, I've already said in this thread, before your post, that Pchan had the best terminology for it. Again, I don't care semantics, and that was never what the argument was about for me. The increase in percentage that my math showed though was correct every time, spare typos (the delay haste thing).
Again, Pchan has the best explanation for the actual word that should have been used.
[+]
Ramuh.Dasva said:
Phoenix.Kojo said:
Speaking of Relics, why is it that no one with a Guttler wears it? Even as town gear.
tbh I'm going to take Veg's advice on ***, He's never given bad advice before and seems to know more than most people do on the subject of DD's.
[+]
Veg, where is your delay/60's in that table? :P
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
It's not possible to determine the rate of attacks without that factor. You're basing your haste returns off an incomplete formula.
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
It's not possible to determine the rate of attacks without that factor. You're basing your haste returns off an incomplete formula.
Shiva.Flionheart said:
tbh I'm going to take Veg's advice on ***, He's never given bad advice before and seems to know more than most people do on the subject of DD's.
[+]
Sylph.Tigerwoods said:
Shiva.Flionheart said:
tbh I'm going to take Veg's advice on ***, He's never given bad advice before and seems to know more than most people do on the subject of DD's.
/shrug
We might of had our run ins but you've always given me good advice when I've needed it. Most people flame without helping at all, and you don't.
[+]
Leviathan.Duvessa said:
Veg, where is your delay/60's in that table? :P
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
[+]
Shiva.Flionheart said:
tbh I'm going to take Veg's advice on ***, He's never given bad advice before and seems to know more than most people do on the subject of DD's.
LULZ Veg has never given advice that wasn't correct about Sam and a lot of help so I'd agree.
[+]
I like Korpg too though. Both are good people when paired up in a thread together >.>
Then it's like nuclear warfare...
Then it's like nuclear warfare...
Ramuh.Urial said:
I know Veg is good an all and Imma let you finish, Korpg is the greatest FF player of all time....OF ALL TIME!
I'm going to rate up your post, sir. I think this is the second rating ever.
Sylph.Spency said:
Ramuh.Urial said:
I know Veg is good an all and Imma let you finish, Korpg is the greatest FF player of all time....OF ALL TIME!
I'm going to rate up your post, sir, I think this is the second rating ever.
Leviathan.Duvessa said:
Veg, where is your delay/60's in that table? :P
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
It's the same thing, delay is just less messy to work with
Quote:
Yes, the rate of attacks, look at my last example.
I'll do this one more time, pay attention, please.
We'll look at the effect of a 20% haste difference in two places.
0% haste vs 20% haste
40% haste vs 60% haste.
1000 delay 0% haste = 1000 delay
1000 delay 20% haste = 800 delay
1000 delay 40% haste = 600 delay
1000 delay 60% haste = 400 delay
We'll use 24,000 units of delay as the time frame, since it's divisible by all our respective delays.
24,000/1000 (0% haste) = 24 attacks
24,000/800 (20% haste) = 30 attacks
24,000/600 (40% haste) = 40 attacks
24,000/400 (60% haste) = 60 attacks.
If haste were linear, you'd get the same percent increase when you go from 0 to 20, from 20 to 40, and from 40 to 60% haste.
0 to 20% haste
30/24 = 25% increase in number of attacks
20 to 40% haste
40/30 = 33.33% increase in number of attacks.
40 to 60% haste
60/40 = 50% increase in number of attacks.
If it were linear, as you claim, then each increment of 20% haste would be the exact same increase, which it is not.
I'll do this one more time, pay attention, please.
We'll look at the effect of a 20% haste difference in two places.
0% haste vs 20% haste
40% haste vs 60% haste.
1000 delay 0% haste = 1000 delay
1000 delay 20% haste = 800 delay
1000 delay 40% haste = 600 delay
1000 delay 60% haste = 400 delay
We'll use 24,000 units of delay as the time frame, since it's divisible by all our respective delays.
24,000/1000 (0% haste) = 24 attacks
24,000/800 (20% haste) = 30 attacks
24,000/600 (40% haste) = 40 attacks
24,000/400 (60% haste) = 60 attacks.
If haste were linear, you'd get the same percent increase when you go from 0 to 20, from 20 to 40, and from 40 to 60% haste.
0 to 20% haste
30/24 = 25% increase in number of attacks
20 to 40% haste
40/30 = 33.33% increase in number of attacks.
40 to 60% haste
60/40 = 50% increase in number of attacks.
If it were linear, as you claim, then each increment of 20% haste would be the exact same increase, which it is not.
Let's do the same thing w/ 60 secs instead of units of delay (by the way it's a conversion for a reason, you'll get the same result).
24,000 delay = 24,000/60 = 400 seconds
1000 delay = 1000/60 = 16.66666667 seconds
800 delay = 800/60 = 13.333333 seconds
600 delay = 600/60 = 10 seconds
400 delay = 400/60 = 6.6666667 seconds
400/16.66666667 = 24 attacks
400/13.333333 = 30 attacks
400/10 = 40 attacks
400/6.666666667 = 60 attacks.
Oh hey, what do you know? We're right back where we started.
30/24 = 25% increase
40/30 = 33.33% increase
60/40 = 50% increase.
Converting delay to seconds means nothing other than putting it in a form you better recognize. If I said wait 10 seconds, you'd have a better understanding how long that would be vs if I said wait 600 delay. The conversion to time has no effect on the actual result, so I don't see why you claim it to be "the most important"
[+]
People need to learn the difference between Marginal benefit versus absolute benefit.
Absolute benefits are typically linear, Marginal benefits are not.
Marginal benefits from Haste increase exponentially, absolute benefits are linear.
Marginal Benefits from stacking Double attack DECREASE exponentially, absolute benefits are linear.
Seriously, it's not a hard concept.
Absolute benefits are typically linear, Marginal benefits are not.
Marginal benefits from Haste increase exponentially, absolute benefits are linear.
Marginal Benefits from stacking Double attack DECREASE exponentially, absolute benefits are linear.
Seriously, it's not a hard concept.
[+]
I'd probably lose it on someone if they said Haste was "exponential" too, but...
What I find funny about the OP is that the graph used to show that haste is linear is still an exponential graph (see "log x" on the x axis).
What I find funny about the OP is that the graph used to show that haste is linear is still an exponential graph (see "log x" on the x axis).
[+]
Never get rate ups :( Once of my posts even had a -5 :(
Ramuh.Dasva said:
Leviathan.Duvessa said:
Veg, where is your delay/60's in that table? :P
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
Leaving out the most important numbers again?! lol
It was stated in the first page that its very obvious damage increases as you attack faster. Anyone can see that. The post was made to compare haste vs delay. Did you even read the OP or just jump in? lol
[+]
All FFXI content and images © 2002-2024 SQUARE ENIX CO., LTD. FINAL
FANTASY is a registered trademark of Square Enix Co., Ltd.