[Archive] Bushido - The Way Of The Samurai (A Guide)

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[Archive] Bushido - The Way of The Samurai (A Guide)
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 Cerberus.Taint
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By Cerberus.Taint 2013-03-04 14:17:17
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Quetzalcoatl.Krylon said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
I'd consider revising the recommended merits to include rounding off zanshin. Possibly better to go 5/5 on ikishoten with the way mobs rotate in the current zergfest. Depending on stp, you might shave a hit, the 2% overwhelm is hard to maintain.

I agree with everything you are saying, but stuff that really matters (ADL, Odin v2, Salvage v2, Legion) - shouldn't you be able to keep in front of the enemy?

I wouldn't mind losing a few % points on a parse in VW in favor of getting a boost in Legion and ADL.



Typically you don't want to be in front of a lot of those mobs.

One of the reasons why Namas spam works so well on high end content is you can stay behind the mob.

5/5 Iki, 5/5 OW - stunning is for mages.
 Quetzalcoatl.Krylon
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By Quetzalcoatl.Krylon 2013-03-04 14:19:23
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Point taken >.<

Taint - if you are interested in doing a Namas SAM write up I can add that to the guide. I will get to it eventually if you are unable to but you know probably 99% more of it than I would.
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2013-03-04 14:26:27
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Quetzalcoatl.Krylon said: »
Recommended merit build: 5/5 Store TP, 5/5 Meditate. 5/5 Overwhelm. 5/5 Ikishoten. Do 4/5 Ikis and 1/5 Blade Bash if your stunners are fail faces.
I also don't really agree with this. 5/5 Meditate is barely (1% tops) better than 5/5 Zanshin, and that's assuming you're some kind of machine at hitting your macro every 2:30, which never happens. 5/5 Zanshin will produce a higher average.
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 Valefor.Sehachan
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By Valefor.Sehachan 2013-03-04 14:32:05
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Missing a hybrid set and Yoichi sets.
 Cerberus.Kvazz
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By Cerberus.Kvazz 2013-03-04 14:34:01
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Also worth mentioning evasion, maybe?
SAM actually has good evasion, and access to good gear for it, so if you want, you can easily evasion-tank on SAM.
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-03-04 14:41:34
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Ramuh.Austar said: »
I also don't really agree with this. 5/5 Meditate is barely (1% tops) better than 5/5 Zanshin, and that's assuming you're some kind of machine at hitting your macro every 2:30, which never happens. 5/5 Zanshin will produce a higher average.

Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.

Quetzalcoatl.Krylon said: »
Recommended merit build: 5/5 Store TP, 5/5 Meditate. 5/5 Overwhelm. 5/5 Ikishoten. Do 4/5 Ikis and 1/5 Blade Bash if your stunners are fail faces.

I found blade bash really handy in nyzul and salvage, since its unlikely you have a stunner near you or at all.

Neither is WRONG, just depends on what you use sam for.
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2013-03-04 14:46:15
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Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin
 Bismarck.Llewelyn
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By Bismarck.Llewelyn 2013-03-04 14:50:24
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Oh wow, the earring was found to be 3? :o
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-03-04 14:51:25
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Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin

Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2013-03-04 14:55:59
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Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin

Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
See no reason why it can't be 3 then.
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-03-04 14:57:11
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Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin
Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
See no reason why it can't be 3 then.


See no reason to spend 3 merits on an assumption or tell people they are wrong because of said assumption.
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2013-03-04 14:58:06
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Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin
Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
See no reason why it can't be 3 then.


See no reason to spend 3 merits on an assumption or tell people they are wrong because of said assumption.
Even if it was 2%, you'd still need 3 merits in Zanshin. Besides, you're assuming it's 2%.
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-03-04 15:00:30
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Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin
Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
See no reason why it can't be 3 then.
See no reason to spend 3 merits on an assumption or tell people they are wrong because of said assumption.
Even if it was 2%, you'd still need 3 merits in Zanshin. Besides, you're assuming it's 2%.

I don't get it, if its 2, thats 50 + 10 + 2 = 62, 2 merits = 64/4 = 16
 Quetzalcoatl.Krylon
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By Quetzalcoatl.Krylon 2013-03-04 15:02:55
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----

Updated the Sub Jobs and Store TP sections.

IDK if the Store TP part is too over the top with the math (I'm praying I did it right. That'd be embarassing....)

Let me know what you guys think. If someone has a simpler explanation then I'm all for it.
 Odin.Zelphes
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By Odin.Zelphes 2013-03-04 15:08:09
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Figured the guide wanted to expand on VW sets since it's still relevant.

Got this TP set as MAX assuming Deluges/Latitude/Valiant+ Fighter's Roll.

Target is Qilin.



Unkai Mimizakari if no Fighter's Roll.

For Amano/Masa.

Would like some input on this.
 Ramuh.Austar
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By Ramuh.Austar 2013-03-04 15:11:53
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Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin
Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
See no reason why it can't be 3 then.
See no reason to spend 3 merits on an assumption or tell people they are wrong because of said assumption.
Even if it was 2%, you'd still need 3 merits in Zanshin. Besides, you're assuming it's 2%.

I don't get it, if its 2, thats 50 + 10 + 2 = 62, 2 merits = 64/4 = 16
Right I looked at something else wrong.
Still, zanshin merits are going to average more regardless and are better defensively.
 Lakshmi.Nightscope
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By Lakshmi.Nightscope 2013-03-04 15:13:37
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What augments are you considering for the helm to beat out 16str/30attack? Is that High Tier Fudo Set considering you have capped attack? Also correct me if i am wrong but that TP high-level isnt even a 5hit? I don't even think it is with Rose strap?

This is mine.
 Odin.Zelphes
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By Odin.Zelphes 2013-03-04 15:15:14
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Lakshmi.Nightscope said: »
What augments are you considering for the helm to beat out 16str/30attack? Is that High Tier Fudo Set considering you have capped attack? Also correct me if i am wrong but that TP high-level isnt even a 5hit? I don't even think it is with Rose strap?

This is mine.

Those augments would beat Mekira marginally during non-active days.
 Cerberus.Taint
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By Cerberus.Taint 2013-03-04 15:16:14
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Odin.Zelphes said: »
Figured the guide wanted to expand on VW sets since it's still relevant.

Got this TP set as MAX assuming Deluges/Latitude/Valiant+ Fighter's Roll.

Target is Qilin.



Unkai Mimizakari if no Fighter's Roll.

For Amano/Masa.

Would like some input on this.


Only swap I make in VW is Phos+1 to Windbuffet.

A) It really doesn't matter VW is lol
B) Over TPing is SAMs friend for the most part
C) TP/WS split for SAM
 Odin.Zelphes
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By Odin.Zelphes 2013-03-04 15:16:20
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Lakshmi.Nightscope said: »
Also correct me if i am wrong but that TP high-level isnt even a 5hit? I don't even think it is with Rose strap?

High-end TP set is 5-hit with Pole/Duplus for Amano/Koga, and Rose for Masa.
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-03-04 15:16:21
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Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Ramuh.Austar said: »
Odin.Jassik said: »
Assuming you have hasso up, there is often no benefit to having 5/5 instead of say 2/5 or 3/5, since Zanhasso is zanshin/4 floored. The typical mid level TP sets would be in the order of ~62% zanshin, 2 merits puts you at 16% zanhasso, where 5/5 puts you at 16% zanhasso.
50 base, 10 unkai +2, 3 earring, 5 merits = 17 zanshin
Since when was the earring confirmed to be 3%, every bit of testing shows 2-3
See no reason why it can't be 3 then.
See no reason to spend 3 merits on an assumption or tell people they are wrong because of said assumption.
Even if it was 2%, you'd still need 3 merits in Zanshin. Besides, you're assuming it's 2%.
I don't get it, if its 2, thats 50 + 10 + 2 = 62, 2 merits = 64/4 = 16
Right I looked at something else wrong. Still, zanshin merits are going to average more regardless and are better defensively.

I'll give you that for sure, but knowing why you put a certain amount of merits is also important, if said earring is confirmed to be 3%, or if a functional TP piece is found to have a Zanshin value, adjusting the merits would be obvious.

I tend to ride Meditate, and I use it for skillchaining, 2/5 zanshin 3/5 meditate puts the recast in a nice sweet spot with other JA's.
 Cerberus.Taint
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By Cerberus.Taint 2013-03-04 15:21:04
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Lakshmi.Nightscope said: »
What augments are you considering for the helm to beat out 16str/30attack? Is that High Tier Fudo Set considering you have capped attack? Also correct me if i am wrong but that TP high-level isnt even a 5hit? I don't even think it is with Rose strap?

This is mine.



I have att6, WSdmg3, SCdmg3

Pretty hard to beat for Kaiten/Namas spam when light is popping off like crazy.
[+]
 Odin.Zelphes
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By Odin.Zelphes 2013-03-04 15:21:10
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Cerberus.Taint said: »
Only swap I make in VW is Phos+1 to Windbuffet.

A) It really doesn't matter VW is lol
B) Over TPing is SAMs friend for the most part
C) TP/WS split for SAM

Set doesn't rely on ticks (if using Unkai Earring) to keep X-build.

So on a practical application, there will be plenty of TP overflow for WS.

I put that set together since the changes consist of pieces that most career SAMs already have in their arsenal.
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By duos 2013-03-04 15:45:22
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I would suggest adding some pointers regarding Yoichinoyumi and its use, keep up the good work.
 Quetzalcoatl.Krylon
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By Quetzalcoatl.Krylon 2013-03-04 16:05:16
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Any feedback on the Store TP section? Does it make sense?
 Odin.Jassik
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By Odin.Jassik 2013-03-04 16:14:47
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Quetzalcoatl.Krylon said: »
Any feedback on the Store TP section? Does it make sense?

Anyone you're appealing to will understand it. The people who don't will just look at the sets and copy them.
 Quetzalcoatl.Krylon
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By Quetzalcoatl.Krylon 2013-03-04 16:28:32
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Odin.Jassik said: »
Quetzalcoatl.Krylon said: »
Any feedback on the Store TP section? Does it make sense?

Anyone you're appealing to will understand it. The people who don't will just look at the sets and copy them.

Good Enough.


Added a few tiny things here and there and made some corrections. Will add a Hybrid Set and Yoichi sets later on.

Thanks for the great replies all.


Oh and, request for sticky? ^^
 Carbuncle.Jsbahamut
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By Carbuncle.Jsbahamut 2013-03-04 16:38:49
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No love for Draca Couse at all? I thought SAM Stardiver was one of the best options for things like NNI.
 Ragnarok.Daffel
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By Ragnarok.Daffel 2013-03-04 16:54:48
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It would also be worth in the job abilities section listing what gear boosts each job ability. Obvious ones like AF/relic hands for meditate but pieces like Myochin Kabuto also enhance Warding Circle by increasing duration by 50% and potency by 2%. Vital for those tough demon fights or soloing demon NMs.
[+]
 Ragnarok.Daffel
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By Ragnarok.Daffel 2013-03-04 17:05:49
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In your WS sets you may also want to mention why they are geared the way they are.

So people will have a better understanding of why some weapon skills require such different builds.
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