Tauret Evis Vs Twashtar Rudras

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Tauret Evis vs Twashtar Rudras
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 Asura.Desperado
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By Asura.Desperado 2020-02-22 11:20:59
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Who wins...?

Elaborate.
 Lakshmi.Avereith
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By Lakshmi.Avereith 2020-02-22 11:45:27
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I have interest in this topic so tagging to view the math that ends up being posted by people smarter than myself. I have tauret and near BiS evis and I'm wondering if it's even worth it to spend the 300+ mil to complete and rank 15 a twashtar
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By fonewear 2020-02-22 11:45:43
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Excel spreadsheet wins.
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 Asura.Bayonette
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By Asura.Bayonette 2020-02-22 11:54:40
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Asura.Desperado said: »
Who wins...?

Elaborate.

This feels like a homework assignment.
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 Lakshmi.Watusa
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By Lakshmi.Watusa 2020-02-22 11:58:36
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Tauret wins if it's a <7:32 minute fight on firesday between 4:00 and 12:00 with 30kmph winds
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By Aquatiq 2020-02-22 12:01:50
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tourette elvis
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By Pantafernando 2020-02-22 12:04:39
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Tauret WSD+50 is too big to extra DEX of Twashtar to make up.
 Asura.Outlawbruce
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By Asura.Outlawbruce 2020-02-22 12:05:40
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Lakshmi.Watusa said: »
Tauret wins if it's a <7:32 minute fight on firesday between 4:00 and 12:00 with 30kmph winds

Well this is all ***. Because you didnt even try to factor in humidity. Hand will slip and slice your hand if you're stabbing that many times with tauret.
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 Asura.Lunafreya
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By Asura.Lunafreya 2020-02-22 12:27:09
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Asura.Outlawbruce said: »
Lakshmi.Watusa said: »
Tauret wins if it's a <7:32 minute fight on firesday between 4:00 and 12:00 with 30kmph winds

Well this is all ***. Because you didnt even try to factor in humidity. Hand will slip and slice your hand if you're stabbing that many times with tauret.

Can confirm, it only wins if you have a dehumidifier strapped to your character’s back.
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 Asura.Bayonette
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By Asura.Bayonette 2020-02-22 13:16:59
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Asura.Outlawbruce said: »
Lakshmi.Watusa said: »
Tauret wins if it's a <7:32 minute fight on firesday between 4:00 and 12:00 with 30kmph winds

Well this is all ***. Because you didnt even try to factor in humidity. Hand will slip and slice your hand if you're stabbing that many times with tauret.


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 Asura.Desperado
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By Asura.Desperado 2020-02-23 12:23:01
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Okay guys I really need your advice that is why I opened this topic as I really need some pro tips here..First lets state out the obvious..

Tauret:
this weapon wins in terms of direct spams with Evisceration. The 50% additional boost to WSD makes this weapon super powerful. Too bad this only works in main hand.

Twashtar: The only thing that makes this weapon strong in main hand is the AM3..So basically, you have to get to 3000TP to begin seeing the potentials of this weapon. I gotta say the increase of damage afterwards is really amazing and noticeable.

NOW.. My question is, which weapon should win the main hand slot? I'm currently going Tauret/Twashtar as Twashtar would be the perfect weapon in the sub slot and tauret as main obviously because it is only worth it if its in main hand. Any suggestions or thoughts would be really appreciated.
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By fonewear 2020-02-23 12:29:02
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Asura.Desperado said: »
Okay guys I really need your advice that is why I opened this topic as I really need some pro tips here..First lets state out the obvious..

Tauret:
this weapon wins in terms of direct spams with Evisceration. The 50% additional boost to WSD makes this weapon super powerful. Too bad this only works in main hand.

Twashtar: The only thing that makes this weapon strong in main hand is the AM3..So basically, you have to get to 3000TP to begin seeing the potentials of this weapon. I gotta say the increase of damage afterwards is really amazing and noticeable.

NOW.. My question is, which weapon should win the main hand slot? I'm currently going Tauret/Twashtar as Twashtar would be the perfect weapon in the sub slot and tauret as main obviously because it is only worth it if its in main hand. Any suggestions or thoughts would be really appreciated.

This is my main hand

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By SimonSes 2020-02-23 12:36:45
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Some time ago I made such comparison in main THF thread I think, so you can start with trying to find it first.
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By fonewear 2020-02-23 12:37:23
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Make both do your own homework.
 Bahamut.Celebrindal
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By Bahamut.Celebrindal 2020-02-23 13:05:36
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Asura.Desperado said: »
I'm currently going Tauret/Twashtar


fonewear said: »
Make both do your own homework.


The really scary thing is, he has both. At least how I read it.
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By SimonSes 2020-02-23 13:13:45
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Bahamut.Celebrindal said: »
Asura.Desperado said: »
I'm currently going Tauret/Twashtar


fonewear said: »
Make both do your own homework.


The really scary thing is, he has both. At least how I read it.

His question is actually not surprising (assuming he using Twashtar main with Cento offhand) even if he has both. If my memory servers me right Tauret/Twashtar and Twahstar/Cento are so close to each other that it would be hard to spot a difference, unless you would make several very controlled parses. Obviously that's assuming you dont take advantage of self skillchain, because then Rudra spam is obviously way better.
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By SimonSes 2020-02-23 13:16:43
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SimonSes said: »
Some time ago I made such comparison in main THF thread I think, so you can start with trying to find it first.

Check my post here and probably comments after it and maybe before it too.
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By Nariont 2020-02-23 13:29:01
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Out of curiosity does this change if the job is dnc instead?
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By SimonSes 2020-02-23 13:32:17
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Nariont said: »
Out of curiosity does this change if the job is dnc instead?

Yes, a lot.

Main reason being Climactic Flourish. While THF not always can use SA and TA, DNC can always use Climactic and 3x Rudra with Twashtar/Cento during one Climactic Flourish is already enough to overcome Tauret.

Another reason is that THF with native TA, higher base crit damage and better TA/CRD items gets more from Evisceration and white damage crits.

DNC also has higher accuracy, so it's easier to use Cento offhand.
DNC also has highest skillchain bonus in game, so you generally want to play around it, making Twashtar even more obvious.

It's worth to mention too, that DNC has access to other dagger that beats Tauret, which is Terpsichore and unlike Twashtar, Terpsi doesn't require non ilvl dagger offhand to do it.
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By Pantafernando 2020-02-23 13:59:46
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fonewear said: »
Asura.Desperado said: »
Okay guys I really need your advice that is why I opened this topic as I really need some pro tips here..First lets state out the obvious..

Tauret:
this weapon wins in terms of direct spams with Evisceration. The 50% additional boost to WSD makes this weapon super powerful. Too bad this only works in main hand.

Twashtar: The only thing that makes this weapon strong in main hand is the AM3..So basically, you have to get to 3000TP to begin seeing the potentials of this weapon. I gotta say the increase of damage afterwards is really amazing and noticeable.

NOW.. My question is, which weapon should win the main hand slot? I'm currently going Tauret/Twashtar as Twashtar would be the perfect weapon in the sub slot and tauret as main obviously because it is only worth it if its in main hand. Any suggestions or thoughts would be really appreciated.

This is my main hand


This is the only weapon you need. Singlewield btw.

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By Nariont 2020-02-23 14:15:35
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SimonSes said: »
Nariont said: »
Out of curiosity does this change if the job is dnc instead?

Yes, a lot.

Main reason being Climactic Flourish. While THF not always can use SA and TA, DNC can always use Climactic and 3x Rudra with Twashtar/Cento during one Climactic Flourish is already enough to overcome Tauret.

Another reason is that THF with native TA, higher base crit damage and better TA/CRD items gets more from Evisceration and white damage crits.

DNC also has higher accuracy, so it's easier to use Cento offhand.
DNC also has highest skillchain bonus in game, so you generally want to play around it, making Twashtar even more obvious.

It's worth to mention too, that DNC has access to other dagger that beats Tauret, which is Terpsichore and unlike Twashtar, Terpsi doesn't require non ilvl dagger offhand to do it.

Thanks for the quick rundown I'd forgotten how silly climatic is. Assumed it was going to favor twash more, mainly due to the lack of crit dmg/natural TA dnc has in traits/ws gear as compared to THFs setup, like you said in the case of THF if you can SC rudras obviously going to pull ahead so I mainly meant in a raw dmg perspective from each.

DirectX said: »
I thought climatic flourish was a single hit thing that you use before a ws. How can you do 3 ws with one climatic flourish?

its a forced crit based on number of finishing moves consumed for the flourish, so up to 5 if i remember right
 Asura.Nebohh
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By Asura.Nebohh 2020-02-23 14:15:59
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fonewear said: »
Make both do your own homework.
To the OP, it really depends how you come off. If you see a lot of trolling, its perhaps because either:
1) No one knows the answer or
2) No one wants to do the homework for you.

Someone did mention to refer to the main THF thread but when you open a new thread like this (without any input yourself):
Asura.Desperado said: »
Who wins...?

Elaborate.
It just seems like you want someone else to do the work for you.
Just saying...
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By SimonSes 2020-02-23 14:36:05
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Nariont said: »
DirectX said: »
I thought climatic flourish was a single hit thing that you use before a ws. How can you do 3 ws with one climatic flourish?

its a forced crit based on number of finishing moves consumed for the flourish, so up to 5 if i remember right

Up to 6 actually with empy head and it works like that:
It forces crit on first hit of an attack round or first hit of WS and lasts for 6 rounds/WSs.
Usually you pop it right before WS, so it's something like that:
CM#1:WS
Reverse Flourish
CM#2:WS
CM#3:Attack Round
CM#4:Attack Round
CM#5:Attack Round
CM#6:WS

Of course if you mix Climactic Flourish with SP abilities and/or temp items you can do 6+ Climactic Rudra in a row, which I reference a lot while talking about DNC being among top burst damage jobs for zerg.
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By Gruknor 2020-02-23 22:31:22
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SimonSes said: »
Nariont said: »
Out of curiosity does this change if the job is dnc instead?

Yes, a lot.

Main reason being Climactic Flourish. While THF not always can use SA and TA, DNC can always use Climactic and 3x Rudra with Twashtar/Cento during one Climactic Flourish is already enough to overcome Tauret.

Another reason is that THF with native TA, higher base crit damage and better TA/CRD items gets more from Evisceration and white damage crits.

DNC also has higher accuracy, so it's easier to use Cento offhand.
DNC also has highest skillchain bonus in game, so you generally want to play around it, making Twashtar even more obvious.

It's worth to mention too, that DNC has access to other dagger that beats Tauret, which is Terpsichore and unlike Twashtar, Terpsi doesn't require non ilvl dagger offhand to do it.

What is cento?
 Lakshmi.Buukki
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By Lakshmi.Buukki 2020-02-23 22:33:52
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Centovente
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By Gruknor 2020-02-23 23:04:37
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Lakshmi.Buukki said: »
Thanks Buuki
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-24 01:30:27
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Slightly OT but I finally managed to test my Twashtar (only rank 11) with Centovente offhand in Dynamis Jeuno.
It was my first time playing DNC in a loooong time, so pardon me if I was a bit rusty.
We had a full alliance like usual.

I ended up second in the parse, ~5% behind the first who was a R15 Vere Monk (dualboxed, so the difference could've been bigger if he focused).
Right behind me were a really tough WAR and a powerful COR. They were very close. Granted I died once so I lost a bit of DPS.
Oh! Also I didn't notice my food wearing for like 10-15 mins so that lowered my stats a bit too.

On the Wave2 Megaboss Zerg I ended up second as well, this time behind the WAR though.



Now 2nd place is not that bad and I guess I didn't have optimal buffs (rolls were SAM and Regain for instance) but I noticed that more often than not I ended up with over 2k TP, sometimes even 3k.
Be it because the target dies before you can WS, or because you're gaining TP from the Regain (ring/turms+1/roll) while moving from one group to another, be it the lag or whatever else, but I noticed it happened to me many times, not just a couple for the whole run.
Situations like these really hurt a Centovente build in my opinion.

(also I was rusty and slow and didn't maximize the climatic Flourish, probably used it ~75% of the amount of times I could've, and getting 3x WS during Climatic with Dynamis lag is not always an easy task)



Still, despite my results I can see Twashtar/Centovente being incredibly powerful for most (all?) other content.


Edit:
I was /DRG because I wanted to try something new, and kept Saber Dance up... most of the time at least lol.
Didn't really use jumps or anything else, /DRG was mostly for the 5% WSD. Not even sure if it's worth it, but if you're gonna Saber over Fan Dance I'd say it is, since Saber's DA doesn't stack with /WAR's DA.
 Asura.Sechs
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By Asura.Sechs 2020-02-24 01:36:15
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Btw is Twashtar considered to be the BiS offhand for a THF willing to mainhand Tauret?

Does it outperform the classic Aeneas/Twashtar combination?
From my small, irrelevant tests on THF I did recently with some parsing, I noticed Tauret/Twashtar performs much better than I expected, if I just spam WS without using TA/SA, it might be even better.

But if I start using TA/SA, spamming Evis (with Tauret) and Rudra (with Aeneas) and then Rudra when TA/DA are up (with both), then Aeneas/Twashtar pulls ahead quite clearly.


At least this is the impression I got, but I can acknowledge it was a small parsing sample so not particularly relevant.
Plus my gear on THF is pretty meh anyway.
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