Random Politics & Religion #26

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Random Politics & Religion #26
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-07-27 18:53:13
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Bahamut.Ravael said: »
Sylph.Cherche said: »
Well enough that despite constant bitching by conservatives, they haven't managed to do a damn thing about it.

You know, despite having house and senate majority.

You won't see me defending the Republicans in Congress very often. That being said, I'm debating if I'd prefer a hive-mind of idiots (like the Congressional Democrats) or the hodgepodge of idealists, cowards, and RINOs like we currently have that at least pretend to think for themselves.

I think this is probably the biggest difference between the current left and right. Those on the left righteously defend their team with the fanatical devotion of cultists. Because they are so religiously dedicated to "The Cause" they foolishly assume their mortal enemies, the rights, are similarly dedicated to their own team. Those on the right know their side is full of idiots and have long since lost faith in their own cause, it's why Trump won the Republican primary and later the election.
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 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-07-27 21:07:57
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https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2017/07/bill-browders-testimony-to-the-senate-judiciary-committee/534864/


If you're going to read a testimony this would be the one to read.
 Phoenix.Amandarius
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By Phoenix.Amandarius 2017-07-27 21:17:36
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Can you imagine how big of a loser someone has to be to read Hillary's new book? I mean seriously.
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 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-07-27 21:25:14
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Phoenix.Amandarius said: »
Can you imagine how big of a loser someone has to be to read write Hillary's new book? I mean seriously.

Also true.
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-07-27 21:37:46
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Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »

So Russians are extremely corrupt?

I kinda said this awhile back, that Russia is the kind of place where a handful of Oligarchs run everything with the help of corrupt government officials. It's impossible for anyone to do business with any Russian entity without dealing with one of these oligarchs and their corrupt government connections. Thus pretending some business transactions between pre-candidate Trump and somebody in Russia is "evidence" for the "theft of the 2016 election" is transparent ***.
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 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-07-27 21:45:44
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Asura.Saevel said: »
Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »

So Russians are extremely corrupt?

I kinda said this awhile back, that Russia is the kind of place where a handful of Oligarchs run everything with the help of corrupt government officials. It's impossible for anyone to do business with any Russian entity without dealing with one of these oligarchs and their corrupt government connections. Thus pretending some business transactions between pre-candidate Trump and somebody in Russia is "evidence" for the "theft of the 2016 election" is transparent ***.


It's funny how you start sounding like there is a strong possibility you read it. Then you make a conclusion that indicates the contrary.
 Phoenix.Amandarius
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By Phoenix.Amandarius 2017-07-27 21:46:11
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Candlejack said: »
Sylph.Cherche said: »
Well enough that despite constant bitching by conservatives, they haven't managed to do a damn thing about it.

You know, despite having house and senate majority.
They also have the White House and SCOTUS. Literally, single-party rule and nothing is getting done. They have no one to blame but themselves. *** magnificent to watch the madness going on. They can't even blame the dems for anything, because it's their own people, like McCain, defecting to stand with the Dems.

Now imagine if Democrats didn't obstruct and actually lifted a finger to fix the mess they created with Obamacare then people might actually get the help they need. But since Chuck Schumer said months ago they will oppose anything Republicans put forth even if he thinks it's a good idea and considering Republicans don't march in lockstep like Democrats, you can kinda see where this is going; Americans will continue to suffer with skyrocketing health care costs and Democrats will cheer.
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 Phoenix.Amandarius
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By Phoenix.Amandarius 2017-07-27 21:49:04
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Obama funded terrorism in Syria for the last five years which led to the deaths of hundreds of thousands of people and created a world-wide refugee crisis as millions of people were displaced. I'd rather not hear how bad you think Russia is when you can't even acknowledge what a horrible human Obama is and the crimes against humanity that he committed.
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By Viciouss 2017-07-27 21:59:53
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lol
 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-07-27 22:07:38
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Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »
Asura.Saevel said: »
Lakshmi.Zerowone said: »

So Russians are extremely corrupt?

I kinda said this awhile back, that Russia is the kind of place where a handful of Oligarchs run everything with the help of corrupt government officials. It's impossible for anyone to do business with any Russian entity without dealing with one of these oligarchs and their corrupt government connections. Thus pretending some business transactions between pre-candidate Trump and somebody in Russia is "evidence" for the "theft of the 2016 election" is transparent ***.


It's funny how you start sounding like there is a strong possibility you read it. Then you make a conclusion that indicates the contrary.

How the hell did you get that.....

That guys entire testimony was that Russia was corrupt, that Putin was also corrupt, that all business in Russia was controlled by a small set of oligarchs who in turn used corrupt government officials. At the end he crossed over from fact into conjecture about how Russian agents might use US entities as unwitting pawns. Again that's pretty standard stuff, the US does the same along with the UK, Germany, France, Israel and even places like Japan and South Korea.

Zero we know your not going to listen, your faith blinds you to your folly.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-07-27 22:12:20
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Asura.Saevel said: »
... pretending some business transactions between pre-candidate Trump and somebody in Russia is "evidence" for the "theft of the 2016 election" is transparent ***.
It isn't. Its at best evidence of influence.

Phoenix.Amandarius said: »
Now imagine if Democrats didn't obstruct and actually lifted a finger to fix the mess they created with Obamacare then people might actually get the help they need....
I had a cartoon for that Aman. But I lost it.
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-07-27 22:18:07
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Garuda.Chanti said: »
It isn't. Its at best evidence of influence.

It's not even that...

That's like saying the cashier at the 7/11 has "influence" over you because you bought a snickers bar there three years ago. The pizza delivery dude has "influence" over you because he delivered you that pizza last week and you paid him a tip. Or that some liberal university has "influence" over Obama because they paid him for a speech.

You took that word and stretched it so far that it has long since lost all meaning or value. Hell according to your own logic the Russians have "influence" over you, we should put you in jail for that.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Six_Degrees_of_Kevin_Bacon
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 Garuda.Chanti
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-07-27 22:35:19
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"at best"
 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-07-27 22:45:31
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Garuda.Chanti said: »
"at best"
Not you too Chanti.

Don't fall into the conspiracy trap. This "Russiagate" is the liberals version of the birther conspiracy.

Don't fall for it. At least, don't entertain the thought. It will haunt you for the rest of your life....or the next 8 years, whichever comes first.
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 Asura.Saevel
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By Asura.Saevel 2017-07-27 22:51:32
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Garuda.Chanti said: »
"at best"

And as I said, it's not even that. "At best" it's evidence that Trump knew a Russian business person, that's it. Influence would require evidence that Trump listened to unsolicited advice from said Russian person, and yeah good luck with that. Trump doesn't even listen to his own trusted advisers and you think he's going to take orders from a foreign entity.

As King said, this is just like the stupid "Obama is a Kenyan with a fake birth certificate" *** that ignorant conservatives pulled. They hollered and hooted on how Obama was going to be removed because he wasn't a legal President, patted each other on the back about how this event or that would be the final straw to expose the illegal President. Ultimately it only served to show up dumb, ignorant and utterly out of touch they were.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-07-27 22:54:06
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The Senate takes time off healthcare to bipartisanly spit in Trump's eye.
The Hill. My headline.

Quote:
Senators are sending legislation slapping new sanctions on Moscow to President Trump's desk, setting up a potential showdown with the White House over Russia.

Senators voted 98-2 on the bill, which would give Congress the ability to block Trump from lifting the Russia sanctions. It also includes new penalties against Iran and North Korea.

Sens. Rand Paul (R-Ky.) and Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) voted against the bill, with Sanders saying on Twitter that "following Trump's comments that he won't recertify Iran’s compliance with the nuclear agreement I worry new sanctions could endanger it."

The move marks congressional Republicans' first significant rebuke of Trump's foreign policy, where the administration's warmer stance toward Russia has drawn heavy skepticism from both parties.

Underscoring the bipartisan support for the bill, senators agreed to temporarily set aside their days-long fight on repealing ObamaCare so they could debate and pass the sanctions bill.

The vote comes hours after a top White House official floated that Trump could potentially veto the legislation.

Communications director Anthony Scaramucci told CNN that "he may sign the sanctions exactly the way they are, or he may veto the sanctions and negotiate an even tougher deal against the Russians."

But senators were quick to warn that vetoing a bill that passed the House 419-3 earlier this week would be a significant misstep for Trump. An earlier version of the bill, which did not include North Korea penalties, passed the Senate in a 98-2 vote.

Sen. Bob Corker (R-Tenn.) downplayed the chance that Trump would use his first veto on the bill, noting he had talked to the president and Secretary of State Rex Tillerson about the legislation during the past week.

"It's just not a good way to start a presidency to veto something and then be soundly overridden," the Foreign Relations chairman told reporters. "It's not something I would do, but they might choose to do it."

Sen. John Cornyn (R-Texas), the No. 2 Senate Republican, added separately that vetoing the bill would be a "mistake."

The Russia sanctions vote marks the GOP-controlled Congress's biggest legislative victory to date. Major GOP agenda items, including ObamaCare repeal and tax reform, are running months behind schedule, and lawmakers do not yet have a deal on how to raise the debt ceiling or fund the government in the fall.

Senators started trying to get a deal to fast-track the legislation on Wednesday night. Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) noted earlier Thursday that Democrats had agreed to let the bill move quickly.

The New York Democrat cast skepticism on the Trump administration wanting to negotiate a tougher deal with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

"The idea that the President would veto this legislation in order to toughen it up is laughable. I’m a New Yorker, too, and I know bull when I hear it," he said from the Senate floor. "If the President vetoes this bill, the American people will know that he’s being soft on Putin."

Trump and top administration officials have expressed a desire to try to improve the U.S.-Russia relationship, which became increasingly bitter under the Obama administration.

Tillerson acknowledged during a congressional hearing earlier this year that they were trying to figure out if, as part of larger negotiations, there was a way to give back two diplomatic compounds, in New York and Maryland, that were seized in retaliation for Russia's meddling in the 2016 presidential race so Moscow could use them for "recreational" purposes.

The bill would block the administration's ability to return the compounds without congressional approval.

In addition to slapping new financial penalties on Moscow, it would give Congress 30 days — or 60 days around the August recess — to review and potentially block Trump from lifting or relaxing Russia sanctions; as well as codify the sanctions on Russia imposed by executive order by the Obama administration, and allow the Trump administration to impose new sanctions.

It would also impose new sanctions in response to Iran’s basic missile program, and target North Korea’s shipping industry and people who use slave labor.

Thursday's vote comes after Corker announced on Wednesday night that they had gotten a deal with House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy (R-Calif.) after the House GOP push to include North Korea sanctions threatened to slow down the bill in the Senate.

Corker said that in addition to the Senate passing the Iran-North Korea-Russia sanctions bill, the House had agreed to move additional penalties against Pyongyang quickly.

Several senators had been working on their own North Korea bills, and Corker suggested this week that senators were also interested in applying congressional review to sanctions against the isolated country.

The Russia legislation has been beset for weeks over a string of setbacks.

The bill ran into a hurdle almost immediately after passing the Senate in a 98-2 vote, when the House parliamentarian said the legislation violated a constitutional requirement that all revenue bills start in the House.

After the Senate approved changes to address the constitutional issue, House Democrats then objected to a provision requested by GOP leaders that prevented them from forcing votes to block Trump from lifting sanctions.

A compromise reached over the weekend ensures that any House member can force a vote on a resolution of disapproval to block sanctions relief that has already passed in the Senate.
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By Garuda.Chanti 2017-07-27 23:05:28
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Asura.Saevel said: »
As King said, this is just like the stupid "Obama is a Kenyan with a fake birth certificate" *** that ignorant conservatives pulled. They hollered and hooted on how Obama was going to be removed because he wasn't a legal President, patted each other on the back about how this event or that would be the final straw to expose the illegal President....
I would remind you that our current president was among them.
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By Viciouss 2017-07-28 00:40:34
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Well, I would expect a Trump tantrum any moment now, as the pathetic "skinny repeal" just went down in flames.
 
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 Phoenix.Amandarius
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By Phoenix.Amandarius 2017-07-28 05:59:39
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You can always tell when you're talking to someone that's never paid/seen a health insurance bill.
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 Siren.Mosin
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By Siren.Mosin 2017-07-28 07:34:35
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You can always tell when you're talking to someone who welches on thier bets.
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 Asura.Kingnobody
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By Asura.Kingnobody 2017-07-28 09:19:44
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You can always tell when somebody can't get over something.
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 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-07-28 09:20:24
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Candlejack said: »
INCOMPETANCE

Our reigning king of irony can't spell incompetence. I'm shocked.
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 Sylph.Cherche
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By Sylph.Cherche 2017-07-28 09:26:06
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My health insurance is rather affordable. It went up with the ACA being implemented, but not by any absurd amount.
 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-07-28 09:41:59
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Sylph.Cherche said: »
My health insurance is rather affordable. It went up with the ACA being implemented, but not by any absurd amount.


You know what else went up under Obamacare? Health Insurance profits and CEO wages. Total failure y'all.

https://www.axios.com/the-sky-high-pay-of-health-care-ceos-2442398819.html
 Lakshmi.Zerowone
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By Lakshmi.Zerowone 2017-07-28 09:43:27
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*CEO earnings


Because someone will get into the semantics of wages and ignore total earnings.
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By Siren.Mosin 2017-07-28 09:45:09
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Asura.Kingnobody said: »
You can always tell when somebody can't get over something.

just want to make sure everyone knows who they're dealing with. A dishonest person.
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 Bahamut.Ravael
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By Bahamut.Ravael 2017-07-28 09:48:10
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If we repeal the ACA 12 million people will immediately drop dead. Do Republicans want people to die?

YouTube Video Placeholder
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 Siren.Mosin
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By Siren.Mosin 2017-07-28 10:18:02
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I do, but I'm an independent.
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